BOARD OF PUBLIC UTILITIES
WORK SESSION - 4/2/2025, 5:30 p.m.

Los Alamos County - Council Chambers

Transcript begins at agenda item 4.a. - Overview of County Council's 2025 Strategic Leadership Plan

00:06:26.000 --> 00:06:32.000  (Suzie Havemann)
With regulatory standards. Are there any questions on quality governance?

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Could I make a comment? Please. We know that council is very busy and has been for a long time.

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And one way for any entity that's got a high workload to manage that workload is to delegate effectively that isn't just saying, you know, go do something. You got to give people guidance and all that.

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One resource that I don't think we have we in this county have used as effectively as we could for a number of years is our boards and commissions.

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If you go back to the 70s and 80s in the early years of this charter government.

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We had fewer boards and commissions. And they generally carried a great deal more weight than they do now. I'm not referring to utilities board specifically. We have our own kind of separate charter, but the other boards, I think it's fair to say that they might have been

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Held in higher esteem back then than in than they are now. And it was easier to get people to participate. Had fewer ones also.

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So that might be one way of council reducing its workload and increasing engagement in the community.

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So I will, I definitely take note of that and um and share the sentiment behind it.

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I think the devil's always in the details and um So for example, I'll just give you an example recently um we briefly talked about revisiting a plastic bag ban.

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At a January meeting and determined at that meeting that we're going to delegate that back to the ESB, the Environmental Sustainability Board.

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To kind of do the nuts and bolts research on that, look at what a policy like that might look like, et cetera, et cetera. Then bring, and so I know that now the ESB has established a working group to focus on that.

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And that's something maybe, you know, maybe if we didn't have that mindset, we might have just some of us who are passionate about that might have just taken that on ourselves, but instead we are leveraging our boards.

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So I think we need to always keep that front of mind and remember to do that more and maybe give even specific tasks on things that fit in with some of our goals that we're going to talk about tonight.

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Is that kind of what you're saying? Yep. Sure am. Thank you. Excellent. Thank you.

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All right. Thank you. Any other questions on the quality governance goal?

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All right. Sure. I have a question. How do you propose to measure whether you're effective in your outcomes?

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What are our metrics going to be? And I would have to go to our dashboard, which I don't have at my fingertips, so I apologize. Does anybody have that up?

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By chance. No, no. I would have to go look at that. I've delegated that to

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I'm going to make a note to look at that and make sure that I can just rattle that off. I could guess, but I don't want to guess. We have specific metrics on each of the things that were kind of collected.

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They're actually determined by the department directors and then fed in and kind of we get a brief presentation on that.

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At the end of last year, beginning of this year. And it's always going to be, I think we'll be modifying that as we get input and see what's being, you know.

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Effective and what's not valuable and that adding value and not adding value. You might ask your boards too.

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Rather than just department Yeah, that's a good point. And that may have happened in some cases, but you're right. Not all.

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Thank you for that reminder. I'm writing that down too.

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Excellent. Okay, next goal.

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Operational excellence. This is having structures, processes, and standards and oversight in place to ensure effective services are efficiently delivered.

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With our available resources. What's new in this in this overarching goal is the part of the sentence that says to continue continuously to anticipate and meet future needs.

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So that's something that we added so that we can maybe don't find ourselves behind the eight ball. Let's be thinking ahead, which is kind of the idea of a strategic plan, right? You think that'd kind of be implicit.

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The three primary objectives under this goal include effective, efficient, and reliable services that are customer focused.

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That include collaborative decision making and efficient implementation. Next objective, infrastructure asset management.

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So we're continually evaluating our assets and infrastructure to prioritize funding to maintain and protect those investments, and then secondly, to inform new investments. And that is something that we've talked about quite a bit.

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And I think will be a major focus for this year's budget hearings.

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I think there is going to be a lot of emphasis on, hey, we've done a lot in the last five years or so. We've invested a lot in different assets that the community values. Let's make sure we have the resources in place to protect them, maintain them, upgrade them if necessary before we jump into the next new shiny object.

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Those are my words, not council's words. But that's kind of the idea.

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And third objective under this, especially because of the environment we've been in in the last year or two, is employee recruitment and retention.

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As we all know, that's kind of where the rubber meets the road. Everything that we do is based on the the job satisfaction and quality of our staff and treating them well, paying them well, giving them benefits and doing a good job with recruiting.

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As we all know, is one of the best investments you can make in an organization of this size and diversity.

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Any questions on that? Thank you, Chair Gibson.

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So I've heard some, I want to talk to members of the community One of the statements that I hear is that, you know, county council just or la county spends money on all sorts of stuff.

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And I'm wondering, because, you know, you get into the budget, there's just all this meticulous detail.

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But is there a possibility of having a super, super high level view.

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And with very few categories of what we spend money on. For example, we spend a lot of money on consultants.

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So like how much money do we spend on consultants? How much money do we spend on this? And maybe I can come up with some basic categories, but do we have anything like that?

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In our 470-page budget binder that I just picked up today, I would imagine there's a table in there that's kind of like that, but it's still in my car. That's the problem right there.

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I hear you. And if it's not there, I will request that because I think that'd be a good way to start off the budget hearings, actually. I mean, there's variations of that.

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And there's people in this room who've been through more of these than I've been through. So if we have that already and I'm not thinking of it, please let me know.

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Thank you, consultants.

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But you say consultants, but do you mean like how much of our budget is spent on maybe consultants on salaries, you know, salaries and benefits. Concerts in the park, entertainment, you know, could be one Well, yeah, if you want to get down to that detail, yeah, we do have that. So question noted, if you think of more, you can email me. I'll try to do that. Thank you.

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Request noted, but I better write it down.

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Okay, thank you. All right. Anything else on operational excellence?

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Okay. We're moving on to economic vitality. This is a big one. It comes up in every survey. I think it's important to anyone who lives here.

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It encompasses the ability of the community to diversify, develop, grow, and sustain the many elements necessary for a local economy to flourish.

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First objective under this is housing. As you know, housing, actually, you could argue it touches a lot of our major goals, quality of life.

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Recruitment and retention, et cetera. But as we know, to have a viable workforce in our community, not only for the major employers, but for our small business sector as well, for the hospital, for UNM, schools, we need all the things you need, all the elements for a thriving

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Flourishing economy that's diverse, we need to have a diverse array of housing available. So that has been a big focus. And I think we're making progress in that area. It's baby steps all the time.

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It's not as easy as just being able to buy a piece of land and build a bunch of buildings. It's a whole bunch more that gets into it. I think Dan Osborne, our housing manager, does a great job.

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And so it's just a high level objective. Next objective is local business support.

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This is also a top priority. It's not always as easy as it might sound at first glance. Now that I've gotten in the weeds of it, it's a little different than what I thought it was when I was campaigning for council two and a half years ago.

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We are participants with the new local business coalition. We partner a lot with the Chamber of Commerce and Main Street and the LACDC. We try to make a lot of our decisions based on like, well, how will that impact small business?

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How will that impact future vitality, et cetera? Downtown revitalization fits in with that. And a new aspect of this objective this year is the incentivizing development aspect.

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So we're going to try to be leveraging some tools and resources that could be available with different partnerships to incentivize new development within our downtown master plans and White Rock master plan as well.

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Also new this year is an objective to encourage and support educational arts, cultural, and historical amenities. There's just a whole bunch of data out there that says communities that do this get a lot of economic return on their investment. And this is just a new

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Approach to to enhance economic vitality beyond what people maybe think of that you could do with sports and outdoor recreation.

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And, you know, other kinds of traditional tourism endeavors.

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And there's a lot going on in that space too right now as we speak.

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Tourism and special events is an objective under economic vitality and the additions here include indoor and outdoor leveraging our indoor and outdoor recreation facilities. For example, the ice rink hosting a lot of big tournaments with teams from all over the place, etc.

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And our efforts with community broadband also fall under economic vitality, and that is in process as we speak.

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Any questions on economic vitality? Yeah, I do have a couple of questions. I guess one overarching one.

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A number of years ago, I was on the Economic Vitality Action Team for the county manager a long time ago. Thank you. It's the same list. It has not changed. I met with somebody on that at three o'clock today. Yeah. And chuckled nervously. And so I guess the question is, what pragmatic steps do you or the council have in mind to take

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To try to get some of these things done. I think you could look at any sort of objective measure, number of new housing starts local you know vitality of local businesses, number of new business starts, downtown revitalization. It's all bad on any measure, right?

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So, and I understand there's many, many things that feed into that, but what kind of pragmatic steps Do you and the council have in mind? Like things that are within your power to try to do to try to help

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Move the ball down the field on some of these. On any issues or on the economic vitality? All of it. I mean, there's housing cultural you know economic vitality there's downtown revitalization MRAs and stuff like that. Also broadband, obviously, we've had a lot of internet troubles.

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Lately, right? So those are four pretty meaty, pretty meaty topics that have been around for a long time.

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Yeah, but they've been around for a long time because they've been important for a long time and we've had gaps on these for a long time, but that doesn't mean we haven't made progress on these.

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I mean, there has been a lot of new housing units developed way more than there were 10 years ago. I mean, there's been a lot of new housing units.

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You know that we just last week passed or are going to partner with a local developer to guarantee that 87 units right over here.

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Will remain affordable. Through a deed restriction that will last 20 years. And we're also going to support the rehab of 25% of the units. We finished the senior. I could list all the housing units if you like. I've got a list in my briefcase, but I don't know if you want to go that detail.

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We have. Partnerships and opportunities with Main Street for the local economic development act you know the lead loans, which has been kind of a high conversation piece in our community this past year.

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There's the MRA activities that are happening in White Rock and in Los Alamos. There is development activity going on in White Rock.

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Some of it's still being developed with private developers, so it's not really for public, it's not out in the public yet.

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There was a conversation about purchasing the property on Diamond Drive you know there was not there's not consensus on There is a lot of activity going on with tourism promotion and special events. I think our community services division does an outstanding job with

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With those kinds of endeavors and investments, you know, just with activities, facilities drawing people here. We do a lot with tourism. I guess I'm not really sure If you have suggestions, I'm all ears. I wasn't prepared to go into that kind of detail. I apologize. We don't need to go into that kind of detail. I'll just say generally

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I feel like I'm at a campaign event. I mean, this is a huge issue, I think, for the town, just as someone who lives here.

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Quite passionate about this. You know, you could say, again, without going into deals, there's been a lot of housing starts. There's been a lot of housing stops and there's been a lot of housing stalls as well.

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Things like the diamond drive issue you talked about, the MRAs are kind of up and you know around and then I don't even know where they are anymore. Right. So there's a lot of conversations, but what we need is

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More, I think, frankly, more leadership and more decision making and more moving along. We've had these county goals, master plans, comprehensive plans. God only knows how many plans, as you pointed out.

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For years and years and years and years and years And… we wind up having lots of conversations and relatively fewer decisions, I think. So I just think we need to move out.

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On a lot of these issues. That's my two cents. So piggybacking on that um Can you tell me what's going on with the Merrimack?

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Thing I've seen all, I saw all these plans for the Merrimack center and apartments and condos and stores and What's going on with that?

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So I don't know um you know um columbus capital, assuming that the company, right? Columbus Capital owns it.

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So it's in private hands. They've leased out the Old Smiths to the laboratory for warehouse space.

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They did present a just a real initial kind of a straw man of a plan, a kind of a concept, I think, to kind of first solicit kind of some pulse from the community.

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And take something initially to planning and zoning. But my understanding is that they have just kind of stalled when it comes to getting financing to do some of the projects they want to do. And I think the rise of interest rates and costs have put them on a stall, but I have not had any personal conversations with them. I don't know. It's private.

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You know, if there was some silver bullet where we could go in and say, hey, we'll go in and build your first apartment complex for you or we'll build you a parking garage or underground parking. That's not a tool we have in our toolbox to do.

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So I know it's frustrating to everybody, just as is the CB Fox and is the diamond drive and other assorted parcels. I think we all share the same frustration. I think I would argue if we really sit back objectively that a lot of good things have happened and if we put on our glass half full.

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You know. There has been a lot of progress.

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And I think that we're always open to suggestions and tangible ones not not the not Because kind of what I heard from you, Charlie, was also just kind of goals. I made this goal to do these things, but it's the tangible and the decision making, but like to do

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I would love to see housing on North Mesa, but there's a whole bunch of hurdles that have to be overcome to make that happen.

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You know, first of all, the schools have to want to make that happen too. There's a whole bunch of players in all of this.

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Brother, you know, and there are some creative things in the works, but when they involve a part private partner, you know, we don't have a whole lot of control over it.

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I guess I would just say this is also for us as a board too. I feel like I try to look for this.

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There are things that are outside of your control or our control in any of these. I understand that.

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But there are things that are within our control, right? Things like often revolve around codes and processes and rules and regulations that we set up so look to I would just say I think there's a lot of opportunity to look to change

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Those to enhance the ability to get a lot of these community-wide goals accomplished personally.

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Yeah. And I think that's, again, for us as a BPU too, that's something we can look at as well within our sphere of influence.

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And that's good. And I think you maybe saw we just hired a new planning manager this week and we had a new community development director coming on next month.

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So that's been part of the challenge too, is having those key departments understaffed, not to make excuses because this has been years, years and years thing. Well, I appreciate all the feedback.

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Truly, and I'm making note

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Thank you. All right. Anything else on economic vitality?

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All right. Next goal, quality of life.

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This is just a general reflection of the community's well-being.

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And the degree to which we all feel healthy, comfortable, welcomed, and included here.

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And are we able to enjoy the activities of daily living. Typically, we rate very high in this area in community surveys. First objective in this goal set is health, well-being, and social services.

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And that includes behavioral, mental, and physical health and social services and amenities to help people with various issues.

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And this is something we try to work on countywide and across the region.

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And this is a big priority for council and staff. So a lot a lot of energy is spent here.

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Inclusion access and belonging used to be called DEI. That's to you know kind of the obvious promote inclusion access and belonging through events and training, facility planning, and expanded opportunities and services for diverse interests. We do have a working group or a task force, I should say, that is working on this. And I think they're bringing some recommendations to council in the next couple of months.

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Mobility is a quality of life objective. To improve and expand access to disability accommodations and alternative modes of travel, including public transit, cycling, walking amenities and services.

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Hopefully you all saw the new Kinicanick park trail Again, we're just taking these baby steps on all of these, but I think that's um an amazing… new amenity.

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Our community. Another objective in this area is open space, parks and recreation. Open space by far always hits the top of the survey results is something that people value and want to maintain in this community And then, of course, public safety also, which always ranks high, but is always a high priority.

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And that includes police and fire. And hazard mitigation and emergency response plans.

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Which we all know we've had you know we've had with the network outages the last couple weeks, this fits in that category as well.

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Any questions on quality of life?

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Okay, next goal is environmental stewardship. This includes some objectives that fall in your guys' BPU's wheelhouse i think It includes the responsible use and protection of the natural environment through active participation in conservation efforts and sustainable practices in coordination with the community and organizational partners.

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This is one where it really does take a village to make progress with this. The first objective in this goal set is natural resource protection to protect our wildlife and wildlife habitat.

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We've had many conversations about this this past year with the public and on council.

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It also includes mitigating tree loss across the community. Water conservation is a very important objective on this and it's something that falls under DPU, as you know.

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And there's a lot of partnerships with Peak, our nature center on this as well.

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And also, you know, harvesting water harvesting for irrigation and using known potable water, which I know you guys have worked hard on and made, I think, some great strides there as well.

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Greenhouse gas reduction has been an objective in this goal set for a while, but this year we added the targets of achieving net zero greenhouse gas emissions by 2050 with the interim targets.

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Of 30% reduction by 2030 and 80% reduction by 2040. Carbon neutral energy supply, which includes the phase out of natural gas.

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Use in county facilities by 2050 and that was a new addition to this objective.

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This year. So phase out natural gas use in county facilities by 2050 and across the board with residences and the commercial sector by 2070.

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That objective had always been there. And then we kind of buttoned up the language in the waste management objective, but the idea is to promote a circular economy by diverting community waste.

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From landfills through recycling, reuse, composting, and waste reduction programs and zero waste programs.

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Which i know you know bpu staff or DPU staff partners a lot with the ESB and our sustainability manager on that quite a bit.

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Oh, I didn't hit the little button. And nobody told me. There we go.

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There you go. I guess you all can, for the people online, I'm sorry about whoever was watching on. That's right. That's just for the online people. I'm sorry for people who are online who missed that.

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Then were there any questions on environmental stewardship? I have one. Please. You've got a goal for net zero greenhouse gas emissions or interim targets, blah, blah, blah.

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Do you have a mechanism for measuring?

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We as council as council we would be piggybacking, I believe, on what's on the climate action plan And what, you know.

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The measurements that will be done through that mechanism. So you're expecting to repeat that process every year. I mean, you can't just wait 10 years and say, okay, let's measure it again. If you're going to see how you're doing.

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You need to be following it. Along. Yeah.

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When I read this, I just kind of, I guess, translate it in my brain to consumption.

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Into whatever consumption is today. Then and that may not be right. That's just how I read it. So whatever consumption is today Then by 2030, it would be 70% of what it is today and like that.

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Right. But how do we know we're 30% lower by 2030? Well, we have consumption. We have the… however many BTUs that we buy Oh, utility. Utilities is fairly easy to measure. Yeah. But there's the other stuff that's part of it too.

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Transportation and transportation and goods consumption.

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I just posed the question. I appreciate it. Yeah, how are we?

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I believe I could have sworn that the climate action plan has something about them coming back like in five years and doing another. Well, of course, a consultant is going to want to come back every five years. No, no, that we actually said that the only way we could actually track our progress was to do that.

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I don't necessarily agree with that, but… That's a separate discussion. With having somebody come back?

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I think we can do it internally and do it far better.

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Okay. Okay, well, this is kind of back to the part of having the boards have input into kind of how we're going about doing things.

00:34:08.000 --> 00:34:16.000
Okay, thank you. I made note of that as well. This is very, very interactive and very productive. I didn't know I was going to walk away with homework and things to think about.

00:34:16.000 --> 00:34:34.000
This is great, actually. We should do more of this. And I'll be more prepared in some of these things. Okay. And then the final two pages of this document include the array of plans that have been done.

00:34:34.000 --> 00:34:48.000
Really kind of organized by our departments that kind of help feed our knowledge and our um the goals and objectives we have with the more recent ones from last year added to the list.

00:34:48.000 --> 00:34:53.000
So you can see there's quite a few, as Mr. Nakale alluded to.

00:34:53.000 --> 00:35:02.000
And I have a comment on those. Please. I certainly didn't look at all of them. Yes, there's a huge array here.

00:35:02.000 --> 00:35:09.000
But I noted as I was scanning through under county manager you've got the Larez report listed as a county-approved plan.

00:35:09.000 --> 00:35:13.000
Now, that wasn't a plan. That was a set of recommendations.

00:35:13.000 --> 00:35:20.000
And it was that report was accepted by That doesn't mean it was adopted.

00:35:20.000 --> 00:35:36.000
There's differences between accepting something and adopting something. And I'm not sure exactly. I mean, I think I think of adopted and approved being more or less synonymous But acceptance is a different thing. We accept reports all the time without

00:35:36.000 --> 00:35:46.000
Saying we're going to implement whatever has been suggested. Sure, that's fair. Are you at the strategic planning session we had last fall?

00:35:46.000 --> 00:36:02.000
You could have given us that input then. Because I think that the title of this is called County Approved Plans. It should not be called that because literally there's studies on here. There's analyses on here. So it really was called, you know, county.

00:36:02.000 --> 00:36:11.000
County reports that something like that. On the other hand, under public utilities, I think the integrated resource plan probably ought to be there.

00:36:11.000 --> 00:36:17.000
Which one were you talking about, Robert? Under utilities.

00:36:17.000 --> 00:36:24.000
And so what's missing? The what? The integrated resource plan for the IRP.

00:36:24.000 --> 00:36:40.000
Yeah, which I think is 2022, I believe. 2022. And I certainly didn't go through all of them, but I get the point yeah that we could kind of, okay. Do you have a new name you would like you would prefer? Not necessarily. It kind of depends what council wants to do with it.

00:36:40.000 --> 00:36:45.000
Some of these may be obsolete by now and maybe shouldn't be here anymore.

00:36:45.000 --> 00:37:07.000
I think it's as much as anything as to inform the public that these things exist. So hey, if you wanted to know more about our hazard mitigation plan, you can know that there's something called that from 2023 I think part of it is just to inform that these things exist and you can, you know, like having an appendix

00:37:07.000 --> 00:37:13.000
Or a bibliography.

00:37:13.000 --> 00:37:27.000
But people do refer to things as this is the approved plan, so we have to do it. Okay, well, we'll work on that. Or it supports what we want to do or something like that when if it's not an approved plan, maybe it doesn't.

00:37:27.000 --> 00:37:36.000
Supported as strongly as it as as it would if it were. Fair enough. Anyway. Okay. Just a point. No, I hear you.

00:37:36.000 --> 00:37:53.000
All right. Anything else? Tough bunch. Thank you. Thank you very much. I enjoyed the dialogue. Thanks. We wanted to make sure you stayed awake. Get your blood circulating. I've had a hard week already. It's only Wednesday.

00:37:53.000 --> 00:38:15.000
Okay. Thank you very much. We'll move on to… Presentation of the County Los Alamos County Fleet Conversion Plan and Community-wide electric vehicle ev Charging plan. And that's Angelica Gurale, our sustainability manager whom I hope is online.

00:38:15.000 --> 00:38:27.000
Okay.

00:38:27.000 --> 00:38:30.000
Angelica, you should be able to unmute yourself.

00:38:30.000 --> 00:38:35.000
Okay. Hi, everyone. Can you hear me or see me?

00:38:35.000 --> 00:38:37.000
We can hear you.

00:38:37.000 --> 00:38:51.000
Okay. Well, you really just need to see my presentation. But I'm here if you want to promote me as a panelist. I'm not sure if that's an option, Kathy.

00:38:51.000 --> 00:38:52.000
It should be.

00:38:52.000 --> 00:39:06.000
Thank you. There we go.

00:39:06.000 --> 00:39:07.000
There you are.

00:39:07.000 --> 00:39:16.000
Okay. Hi. All right. Well, good evening. For those of you who don't know me, I'm Angelica Gurule and I'm the county's Sustainability Manager.

00:39:16.000 --> 00:39:23.000
Thank you for allowing me to present the fleet conversion plan and the community-wide EV charging plan.

00:39:23.000 --> 00:39:28.000
Kathy, do you want me to share my screen?

00:39:28.000 --> 00:39:32.000
I'm happy to do it whichever way is easiest for you, Angelica.

00:39:32.000 --> 00:39:46.000
Okay, go ahead and share. That'll be great

00:39:46.000 --> 00:39:51.000
All right. Thank you. Next slide.

00:39:51.000 --> 00:39:56.000
Give me a sec. I have some Zoom controls in the way of the buttons.

00:39:56.000 --> 00:40:03.000
It's hard to control it in that room, I've noticed.

00:40:03.000 --> 00:40:04.000
I'm always i struggle too. Yeah, I understand what you're going through.

00:40:04.000 --> 00:40:06.000
Thank you for putting that out there for me.

00:40:06.000 --> 00:40:09.000
Cassie manages to get it. Sometimes it takes a few seconds, but she does a great job.

00:40:09.000 --> 00:40:15.000
Well, you're like juggling

00:40:15.000 --> 00:40:22.000
Kathy's awesome. They're double kathy's Okay, so there are three main components to this project.

00:40:22.000 --> 00:40:28.000
There's the fleet conversion plan, which is mostly focused internally to the county.

00:40:28.000 --> 00:40:40.000
There's the community-wide EV charging plan that'll focus you know, primarily, you know, it'll be the community at large only focusing on charging, not so much fleet conversions.

00:40:40.000 --> 00:40:46.000
And then, of course. Important to this process will be our engagement strategy.

00:40:46.000 --> 00:40:51.000
And lastly, tonight we will review key deliverables and our timeline.

00:40:51.000 --> 00:41:02.000
Next slide. So our main purpose to conduct this study is to reduce greenhouse gas emissions from the county's fleet.

00:41:02.000 --> 00:41:09.000
And to assess expanding EV charging infrastructure for the county and for the community.

00:41:09.000 --> 00:41:18.000
And again, lastly, to engage with our community They're listed as partners here, but our residents are our partners board

00:41:18.000 --> 00:41:25.000
Commercial institutions Things like that.

00:41:25.000 --> 00:41:38.000
Next slide. So allow me to briefly acquaint you with our project team. So Eric Plapper is our project manager. He's in the center there. And these are our folks from Stantec Consulting.

00:41:38.000 --> 00:41:52.000
And I will serve as the project lead from the county team. I'd also like to acknowledge Mariano Montoya and Mariano Valdez, who are both DPU staff members who are helping with this study.

00:41:52.000 --> 00:42:02.000
And Pete Mundricho and our fleet manager. And then just one more thank you to Chair Gibson for contributing to the development of the scope of work for this project.

00:42:02.000 --> 00:42:11.000
Next slide, please. All right. So our first, excuse me.

00:42:11.000 --> 00:42:25.000
Our first task focuses on the county fleet. At this point, Stantec will conduct an industry review of all the available electric vehicle options.

00:42:25.000 --> 00:42:39.000
And assess if they are capable of meeting the current current vehicle operations. So you really want to have, you know, a one-for-one equivalent and make sure that it satisfies the need of our operations.

00:42:39.000 --> 00:42:48.000
And that will include a thorough review of available technology vehicle manufacturers and charging and fueling equipment.

00:42:48.000 --> 00:42:54.000
Stantec will also focus on understanding how the county fleet operates.

00:42:54.000 --> 00:42:59.000
To do this, they will conduct site visits, collect data regarding usage.

00:42:59.000 --> 00:43:05.000
Of our current flea and they will also review vehicle and equipment replacement policies.

00:43:05.000 --> 00:43:11.000
They also plan to understand the needs of the facilities that may be impacted by this.

00:43:11.000 --> 00:43:19.000
Daily utilization and requirements of vehicles will be evaluated to ensure that there is an equivalent, an EV equivalent.

00:43:19.000 --> 00:43:25.000
That will satisfy the needs of the county operations. An example of that, for example.

00:43:25.000 --> 00:43:45.000
In solid waste. You know, they might have a truck that needs to pull a trailer to collect trees during the holiday season so We want to make sure that we want to make sure that electric vehicle equivalent is available and will satisfy that need.

00:43:45.000 --> 00:44:10.000
If the technology doesn't currently exist, Stantec will make recommendations you know that would maybe phase out that equipment over time when the technology does exist in the future. So the objective is to understand how chargers will be required at the different facilities to minimize capital costs associated with implementation.

00:44:10.000 --> 00:44:24.000
We all know construction is really expensive. And then once these steps are completed, they will meet with a different county department heads including phyllo, DPU has a large fleet.

00:44:24.000 --> 00:44:32.000
To make sure that we're considering their needs and sharing the information that we have up to that point.

00:44:32.000 --> 00:44:37.000
Next slide, please.

00:44:37.000 --> 00:44:46.000
Okay, so understanding vehicle requirements, Stantec will identify the energy requirements.

00:44:46.000 --> 00:44:52.000
With this information, Stantec will develop a base case versus a zero emissions case.

00:44:52.000 --> 00:45:02.000
So if we did like business as usual today and then comparing that with a model of how we start to transition our fleet over time.

00:45:02.000 --> 00:45:11.000
So this analysis will be really to understand how this will impact reducing greenhouse gas emissions.

00:45:11.000 --> 00:45:19.000
They will also perform a financial analysis to determine and to analyze the cost to implement.

00:45:19.000 --> 00:45:33.000
This type of infrastructure. And they will also provide available funding options to implement infrastructure. So an example of these analyses are on the next page.

00:45:33.000 --> 00:45:43.000
Next slide, please. Since these are only examples at this time, I will continue to the next slide.

00:45:43.000 --> 00:46:01.000
Thank you. As part of the community-wide, so moving on to the second piece of our study is the community-wide EV charging plan. And there's three main components That will be… part of this piece. So there's a contextual scan and assessment

00:46:01.000 --> 00:46:11.000
The technical analysis and an implementation plan. And we will go over these in more detail in the next slides.

00:46:11.000 --> 00:46:20.000
So the Stantec will perform a contextual scan to ensure their recommendations align with the current federal, state.

00:46:20.000 --> 00:46:29.000
And local policies and plans. Such as the New Mexico Clean Car Rule and DPU's Electrification Study.

00:46:29.000 --> 00:46:36.000
Next slide. As part of the technical analysis.

00:46:36.000 --> 00:46:46.000
Process for citing the EV infrastructure We will look at the demand to understand where adoption is now and where it's heading.

00:46:46.000 --> 00:47:03.000
We'll look at the land use and travel patterns. Also, suitability factors like existing utility and transportation infrastructure as well as sensitive land uses we want to avoid will be assessed.

00:47:03.000 --> 00:47:14.000
And then finally, equity will be considered to include a disadvantaged, underserved areas within our communities.

00:47:14.000 --> 00:47:22.000
Next slide. So a major driver for this project is, aside from the climate action plan.

00:47:22.000 --> 00:47:28.000
Is the New Mexico Clean Car Rule, which goes into effect in 2026.

00:47:28.000 --> 00:47:35.000
It establishes cells targets for zero emission vehicles So as you can see on the right.

00:47:35.000 --> 00:47:42.000
82% of light duty vehicles By 2032 is the sales target.

00:47:42.000 --> 00:47:51.000
So Stantec will provide a range of adoption strategies and scenarios to plan for this role.

00:47:51.000 --> 00:47:57.000
Next slide. Okay.

00:47:57.000 --> 00:48:02.000
This is a slide. It's an example from a previous Stantec project project.

00:48:02.000 --> 00:48:18.000
I want to say it's from, oh no not this one. Okay, so it has a conservative So as I had mentioned, there's the different scenarios that they'll present. They'll provide a conservative and aggressive adoption scenarios.

00:48:18.000 --> 00:48:30.000
And it's broken out in five-year increments. And the goal is to estimate the total number of EVs that will correspond to the total number of charging stations.

00:48:30.000 --> 00:48:43.000
Next slide. So once we know these numbers, number of EVs and number of charging stations that we'll need.

00:48:43.000 --> 00:48:50.000
Then Stantec can project where it makes sense to start citing the EV chargers within our community.

00:48:50.000 --> 00:48:58.000
And they call these heat maps. This is an example of a heat map that was developed for West Hartford, Connecticut.

00:48:58.000 --> 00:49:07.000
So Stantec will incorporate all the inputs that we talked about in the previous slides to develop these heat maps.

00:49:07.000 --> 00:49:16.000
Along with feedback that we gather from the community to make sure that we're aligning with their needs as well.

00:49:16.000 --> 00:49:25.000
Next slide. So here's just another example of a heat map that was developed for Miami.

00:49:25.000 --> 00:49:29.000
Next slide. So what you see here is our engagement plan.

00:49:29.000 --> 00:49:34.000
You'll notice we plan to share the draft and the final plan with BPU.

00:49:34.000 --> 00:49:42.000
As they become available. Next slide.

00:49:42.000 --> 00:49:50.000
And these are our project deliverables that some of them of, you know, which we have discussed tonight. So I won't go into too much detail there.

00:49:50.000 --> 00:50:08.000
Next slide. This is our timeline. We kicked off this project in February, the study, and we're currently in the data gathering phase. So thank you to all the GPU staff that have helped contribute data up to this point.

00:50:08.000 --> 00:50:14.000
And we'll soon have a public visioning session and then conduct a public survey.

00:50:14.000 --> 00:50:20.000
And like I mentioned, we plan to share and gather feedback from BPU during the draft.

00:50:20.000 --> 00:50:30.000
And final stages and you're welcome to attend the visioning sessions and take the survey. Next slide.

00:50:30.000 --> 00:50:58.000
Um… So I kind of mentioned the next steps already. We'll be doing the community visioning session Next steps are conducting the fleet and facilities conditions assessment And then reviewing the plans and policies in place And then, you know, analyzing demand, suitability and equity for future placement of EV chargers.

00:50:58.000 --> 00:51:16.000
As you can see, this is a complex scope with a lot of moving pieces, especially the federal policies and funding availability so We're working hard. I feel confident that we have a really knowledgeable team.

00:51:16.000 --> 00:51:31.000
So with that, I'll stand for questions. If I can't answer them, I'll take them back to our consultant and get back with you at a future It's a feature email so

00:51:31.000 --> 00:51:32.000
Okay, thank you, Angelica. Questions? Matt.

00:51:32.000 --> 00:51:36.000
You're welcome.

00:51:36.000 --> 00:51:41.000
I've got a couple. First is a comment. Thanks. I'm really excited to see this work. Thanks for leading on this.

00:51:41.000 --> 00:51:50.000
Electrification of vehicles may be the reason that I got on the board. You remember I gave a presentation before I was on the board I'm still very interested.

00:51:50.000 --> 00:52:00.000
Through my work two years ago One takeaway was that one of the low hanging fruits in the community For community electrification may actually be through the school buses.

00:52:00.000 --> 00:52:07.000
And so I think in the more detailed description that was attached, but that you didn't go through, it did call out LAPS.

00:52:07.000 --> 00:52:13.000
The public schools, but I think maybe including a presentation to the school board, I think on slide 15 you had you know.

00:52:13.000 --> 00:52:24.000
A meeting with the board and a couple of the esports But I think getting this in front of the school board It would also be good. I'd recommend that.

00:52:24.000 --> 00:52:35.000
I think… including other partners. I think the ski hill i can't remember if the ski hill and Mountain Capital Partners is also part of that, but that feeds into tourism.

00:52:35.000 --> 00:52:48.000
I think Bandolier and Valle caldera I know the VIA has some electrification in theirs and so coordinating with what their plans or their thinking are in terms of traffic There's one suggestion.

00:52:48.000 --> 00:53:00.000
And then on slide 12, you said Stantec is going to go to vehicle registrations and pull on that. If you remember, that's what I did two years ago or so through DMV, and I was able to get county level One of the big issues is we have so many commuters here

00:53:00.000 --> 00:53:14.000
That just county registrations don't really tell the story. And so just making sure Stantec has that perspective of we've got We need to include the surrounding communities, think about the commuting aspects.

00:53:14.000 --> 00:53:20.000
I think that was all my comments. I'm excited to engage and see where this goes. So thanks.

00:53:20.000 --> 00:53:21.000
Thank you. Eric.

00:53:21.000 --> 00:53:25.000
Thank you.

00:53:25.000 --> 00:53:38.000
Yeah, so thanks for the presentation. I guess there's going to be a bucket of vehicles that are just going to be exempt or not going to be subject to this program.

00:53:38.000 --> 00:53:45.000
I go to buildings, I asked the question when it came to sustainability and net zero and carbon zero.

00:53:45.000 --> 00:53:51.000
Well, what about things like hospitals that have got life safety codes that are required to have diesel generators?

00:53:51.000 --> 00:54:10.000
You have to have diesel. It's the law. Generators so and then the answer came back oh they're exempt Oh, okay. So, and then fire trucks. They've got some hybrid fire trucks but they're very heavy on the diesel, very light on the electrical, but they can call them hybrid.

00:54:10.000 --> 00:54:24.000
But when we have emergency services, power's out, you've got bucket trucks and you've got Things like that. There are just simply some vehicles that have to remain diesel or gas.

00:54:24.000 --> 00:54:31.000
I guess that'll fall out in the analysis. Are you prepared for that?

00:54:31.000 --> 00:54:49.000
Councillor or Chair Gibson and uh member Stromberg. Yes, we are. I think we're relying on the department heads to give feedback on those so We do have plans to meet directly with the police chief and the fire chief just to make sure

00:54:49.000 --> 00:55:06.000
Which vehicles they want us to analyze so we don't waste their time or ours analyzing vehicles that we just know You know, we know that they're exempt from from this process just based on peer, like you mentioned, purely emergencies or requirements so

00:55:06.000 --> 00:55:07.000
Great. Thank you. Thank you.

00:55:07.000 --> 00:55:11.000
You're welcome.

00:55:11.000 --> 00:55:22.000
Angelica, the… When we look at the the community side Some people are going to be charging at home.

00:55:22.000 --> 00:55:48.000
Or possibly at other private locations. Maybe some businesses will make chargers available for their employees and not necessarily for the public. What I didn't see looking through here was any division in the projections or expectation of dividing you can project maybe how many EVs there will be, but how many of those are going to charge in

00:55:48.000 --> 00:56:09.000
Private locations, homes in particular. Or primarily and how many of those are likely to be need public charging locations. This seems to be focused on the public charging locations but We need to know we need to know how many you're going to need to charge there and how many you're going to charge otherwise.

00:56:09.000 --> 00:56:28.000
The… I think, made the comment was made someplace about the number of EVs versus charging stations. Was that the number of EVs total or the number of EVs that might actually need the public charging infrastructure much of the time. I mean, probably everybody will occasionally but

00:56:28.000 --> 00:56:44.000
So is there a plan to… differentiate between differentiate the public charging infrastructure and what I will call the private charging infrastructure Mostly homes.

00:56:44.000 --> 00:56:52.000
Her Gibson, the way I understand it is And I apologize if I butcher this.

00:56:52.000 --> 00:57:07.000
There are different electric feeders within the community. And when we develop the scope of work, we were comfortable with them providing heat maps that would say, you know, this would be the demand on that certain feeder.

00:57:07.000 --> 00:57:20.000
And with the heat maps, they could then say, you know, along this along this feeder and then we we as a county would probably have to then go in and say you know.

00:57:20.000 --> 00:57:34.000
It would be best suited here because it's county owned versus you know a privately owned area so That's the way I understand how they'll provide that information.

00:57:34.000 --> 00:57:39.000
But I can verify with the consultant if that's helpful.

00:57:39.000 --> 00:57:45.000
Yeah, I'm sorry I didn't fully understand the answer there. And maybe you need to get it clarified from the consultant.

00:57:45.000 --> 00:58:00.000
Okay. So your question is how will your question is how How would it be differentiated where the chargers will be placed commercially or publicly versus privately and at homes?

00:58:00.000 --> 00:58:11.000
Yeah, yes. I mean, we're not so concerned I mean, we, the county are not going to be placing chargers in private homes But we are going to have to provide the power for that.

00:58:11.000 --> 00:58:12.000
Right.

00:58:12.000 --> 00:58:28.000
Now, we're doing our own electrification study right now. That will be an element of it too, but it certainly doesn't hurt to have two different entities looking at the same thing and we can compare answers And see how different entities look at it.

00:58:28.000 --> 00:58:51.000
Kind of related to that is are we attempting at least to coordinate with or at least communicate with the laboratory to determine what they plan to do, might do, could do in terms of charging vehicle, charging commuter vehicles, employee vehicles

00:58:51.000 --> 00:59:00.000
At the laboratory because that could wind up making a big difference in How many people charge on this side of the canyon?

00:59:00.000 --> 00:59:09.000
Chair Gibson, yes, we do have plans to partner with the laboratory and we've also had confirmation that they're interested in partnering.

00:59:09.000 --> 00:59:15.000
I'm glad to hear both of those affirmative answers.

00:59:15.000 --> 00:59:38.000
Okay, you talked about reviewing codes and plans etc But that sounded like maybe reviewing what presently exists is the scope of work, does the scope of work here include recommendations for changes in codes, plans, etc.

00:59:38.000 --> 00:59:47.000
To… either promote or accommodate Depending on how you want to look at it, EVs.

00:59:47.000 --> 01:00:03.000
Chair Gibson, yes, I think just as a default, they will make recommendations for adoption you know different adoption schedules for the fleet And then also, you know, for EV chargers.

01:00:03.000 --> 01:00:18.000
While adoption schedules for the fleet are one thing but i'm thinking of of actual you know codes and plans parking plans, building codes, things of that variety.

01:00:18.000 --> 01:00:24.000
That might well change. I would expect to change versus what exists today.

01:00:24.000 --> 01:00:30.000
I would hope they're not being totally constrained just by what exists today.

01:00:30.000 --> 01:00:38.000
For Gibson, it's not in their scope of work to to recommend code changes.

01:00:38.000 --> 01:00:39.000
Hmm.

01:00:39.000 --> 01:00:57.000
Simply it'll be simply based off of the fleet adoption schedules and future EV infrastructure recommendations.

01:00:57.000 --> 01:00:58.000
Right.

01:00:58.000 --> 01:01:09.000
I don't know that fleet adoption is going to have much impact on codes for the public but And we have to keep remembering the fleet is less than 5% of the county fleet's less than 5% of overall fuel use. So if we're going to meet our goals, it has to be largely through

01:01:09.000 --> 01:01:25.000
Community conversion to EVs, not just the county kind of related to that question of looking in the future, you talked about, I think it was on your first slide about looking at Current technology and what's available But is the consultant looking at

01:01:25.000 --> 01:01:32.000
What they expect or project technology to be in 5, 10, 15, 20 years.

01:01:32.000 --> 01:01:39.000
And are we incorporating reasonable guesses.

01:01:39.000 --> 01:01:43.000
Of that technology in our plans.

01:01:43.000 --> 01:01:46.000
Kirk Gibson, I think I'd like to follow up with the consultant.

01:01:46.000 --> 01:01:59.000
On that i'm not sure what they're… their you know their depth is of knowledge to project future technology advancements so I can ask them how they plan to incorporate that.

01:01:59.000 --> 01:02:09.000
And hold on just a moment here. The militaries are always accused of preparing to fight the last war.

01:02:09.000 --> 01:02:15.000
And this almost sounds like we're trying to

01:02:15.000 --> 01:02:24.000
Do figure out what we would do for today or last year instead of 10, 15, 20 years from now, which is where we're clearly going.

01:02:24.000 --> 01:02:40.000
I'll give you a more relevant example. I was reading the other day, there's a Chinese firm that claims and apparently there's some uncertainty about this, that they've actually got a battery technology that will allow charging within five to 10 minutes, kind of equivalent to

01:02:40.000 --> 01:02:53.000
Filling your gas tank now, but it takes a megawatt charger Well, if something like that is likely to become a standard.

01:02:53.000 --> 01:03:07.000
Over the next several years, that has a big impact on on how we… how we structure the distribution system if we want to try to support even a small number of chargers like that.

01:03:07.000 --> 01:03:25.000
So that's the kind of thing that we need to be looking at. And I've got some other questions here on the board now so Matt. I just had a follow-up specific one on that. Predictions are hard, especially about the future. We all know that. Thank you, Yogi. I'd be curious if

01:03:25.000 --> 01:03:42.000
Stantec is considering or looking at bi-directional charging and what that might do and how the impacts to overall community resilience might be part of the factoring of where we put charging stations if they're bi-directional and they can provide some standby power for outages.

01:03:42.000 --> 01:04:00.000
Gibson, I think as part of their vehicle and equipment analysis, I can recommend that just to make sure it's It's on their radar that we're, you know, we may be interested in something like that.

01:04:00.000 --> 01:04:12.000
Eric. Thank you, Chair Gibson. So one thing I'd really like to see in this study is the average mileage of a fleet vehicle before it's turned in.

01:04:12.000 --> 01:04:20.000
What is the mileage on the odometer? Do we run them for 100,000, 200,000, 300,000?

01:04:20.000 --> 01:04:34.000
The reason I say this is because There's been a lot of studies that show that an EV, first of all, on the showroom floor has got a very, very, very high carbon footprint because of battery technology and the production.

01:04:34.000 --> 01:04:49.000
And you have to drive an EV car for about 70 or 80,000 miles, or I've even seen 100,000 before the carbon footprint will come down to even be equal to a gas car.

01:04:49.000 --> 01:04:59.000
And so if just hypothetically, if our fleet vehicles are being sold at 60,000 miles, if that's all we ever put on them.

01:04:59.000 --> 01:05:04.000
Well, then we're far, far better to just stay with gas.

01:05:04.000 --> 01:05:12.000
Now, we're not going to get any return or advantage until the vehicles have over 70 or 80,000 miles.

01:05:12.000 --> 01:05:16.000
So I'd like to see that as part of the study.

01:05:16.000 --> 01:05:19.000
Can you clarify your question, please?

01:05:19.000 --> 01:05:31.000
Yeah, the question is the question is how many miles does the average fleet vehicle have on it before we get rid of it?

01:05:31.000 --> 01:05:35.000
Because if…

01:05:35.000 --> 01:05:36.000
Because the problem is is that the problem is we can change to an EV.

01:05:36.000 --> 01:05:41.000
An average fleet vehicle and a vehicle and an EV vehicle, you want to see a comparison

01:05:41.000 --> 01:05:46.000
But if we get rid of the vehicle at 60,000 miles.

01:05:46.000 --> 01:05:51.000
The EV is actually hurting us because it's got a higher carbon footprint.

01:05:51.000 --> 01:06:07.000
So it doesn't make any sense to even talk about changing over fleets to EV, Unless we know that our vehicles are being kept for over 80,000 miles.

01:06:07.000 --> 01:06:09.000
I can follow up on that question. You're welcome.

01:06:09.000 --> 01:06:14.000
Okay, thank you very much.

01:06:14.000 --> 01:06:24.000
Do we have any other board questions? Angelica, thank you very much for the presentation and thank you for all the work you're doing.

01:06:24.000 --> 01:06:28.000
To advance this study. This will be.

01:06:28.000 --> 01:06:31.000
Thank you for the opportunity to present. I appreciate it.

01:06:31.000 --> 01:06:34.000
And we're a tough crowd, so we apologize for that.

01:06:34.000 --> 01:06:37.000
You gave me homework. You gave Susie homework. Counselor, homework so Have a good night.

01:06:37.000 --> 01:06:41.000
Yes. You too. Thank you.

01:06:41.000 --> 01:06:45.000
Thank you.

01:06:45.000 --> 01:06:51.000
Okay. Moving on.

01:06:51.000 --> 01:06:57.000
Next item is annual update results of the voice of the customer survey.

01:06:57.000 --> 01:07:13.000
Kathy Deanna. Thank you, Chair Gibson. I would like to introduce Catherine Bollmer and Sophia Vigiant from Great Blue, they're both online. And I think Catherine's doing the talking, but they might surprise us.

01:07:13.000 --> 01:07:15.000
We actually both will. But I'll just pull up my screen really quickly.

01:07:15.000 --> 01:07:19.000
Nice.

01:07:19.000 --> 01:07:26.000
And let's see if this works. We'll go into presentation mode. You guys can all see this, right?

01:07:26.000 --> 01:07:27.000
We can. Yes.

01:07:27.000 --> 01:07:43.000
Perfect. All right. Yeah. So thank you so much for having us back again to share the results of this year's Voice of Customer Survey. We're really excited to share some very positive findings today. So without further ado, we'll go ahead and not do that.

01:07:43.000 --> 01:07:51.000
Let's see. All right. That's better. So just a little bit of an overview about our survey in case anyone is new.

01:07:51.000 --> 01:07:58.000
We conduct this survey on an annual basis. It's really a very comprehensive customer satisfaction survey.

01:07:58.000 --> 01:08:12.000
Really aimed at understanding the areas that the DPO is performing really well in, as well as key areas of improvement. And so we have a list of what we call our organizational characteristics, which we'll go through with you in just a moment.

01:08:12.000 --> 01:08:21.000
We look at things like customer service, field service. We focus a lot in this survey on communication methods and again, ways to enhance those moving forward.

01:08:21.000 --> 01:08:39.000
And then this year we added in some questions that I think will actually tie in well from our last topic that really cover investments in clean energy and how strongly customers support those investments and how willing they are to pay extra money on their bill for those investments.

01:08:39.000 --> 01:08:52.000
So first is our methodology snapshot on the residential side. We do this survey every year entirely digitally. And this year we had 274 residential customers complete our survey.

01:08:52.000 --> 01:09:00.000
We did add a couple questions, like I mentioned, to the survey, but 50 questions is really, you know, we'll take the average customer about 10 to 12 minutes to complete.

01:09:00.000 --> 01:09:15.000
Our margin of error is plus or minus 5.7%. So essentially what that means is that if we were going to compare this to the actual population of all customers. The results of this survey come in about 5.7 percentage points of

01:09:15.000 --> 01:09:20.000
What the actual customer is thinking and feeling about these different topics.

01:09:20.000 --> 01:09:29.000
And we started fielding this study in kind of mid-January timeframe and wrapped things up in February.

01:09:29.000 --> 01:09:34.000
So going through our respondent snapshot here for our residential customers.

01:09:34.000 --> 01:09:51.000
You know looking at age, we did have a relatively even spread. We definitely leaned towards having more older customers, even though the survey was done digitally, we're seeing the digital survey responses don't necessarily lean towards younger customers anymore. They're across the board.

01:09:51.000 --> 01:09:58.000
That's just one thing to keep in mind. We've run a couple of data points by age just to show where there's some interesting breakouts.

01:09:58.000 --> 01:10:07.000
Household size, most folks are, you know, one or two person households Income does tend to lean a little bit towards higher income.

01:10:07.000 --> 01:10:15.000
Looking at renters versus homeowners, we have just under nine out of 10 are homeowners compared to about 10% are renters.

01:10:15.000 --> 01:10:22.000
And then education level, the majority of folks are either college grads or post-grad degrees.

01:10:22.000 --> 01:10:36.000
And then looking at the amount of time folks have been in the community or been customers of the DPU, a lot of folks have been customers for 20 years or more. So again, another thing to kind of keep in mind when we look at the results, you know, obviously, you know.

01:10:36.000 --> 01:10:44.000
When we do these types of surveys, we tend to see that longer tenured customers tend to have a more favorable opinion of their utility company, which is obviously good.

01:10:44.000 --> 01:10:55.000
But some of those newer customers are the ones that tend to be a little bit harder to win over just because they're just newer to the community and don't have as strong of a relationship yet.

01:10:55.000 --> 01:11:17.000
Just one thing to keep in mind as well. On the commercial side of things, we use both a digital and phone survey methodology for this group. It's just a lot harder to get commercial customers to complete digital surveys. So we do have a phone component as well where we'll call through our list a couple of times just to see how many folks we can get to complete the survey.

01:11:17.000 --> 01:11:25.000
This year we had 21 customers take the survey. That's pretty similar to what we've had in the past. Last year, I think we were around 40 surveys.

01:11:25.000 --> 01:11:31.000
We were hopeful to get a little bit more this year, but hopefully a little bit of a higher number next year instead.

01:11:31.000 --> 01:11:36.000
And again, we fielded this in the same relative timeframe as the residential study.

01:11:36.000 --> 01:11:49.000
And then our margin of error obviously is a bigger margin of error here, just knowing that we only were able to speak to 21 respondents. So again, another thing to keep in mind when we look at the ratings, anywhere where you see increases or decreases on the commercial side.

01:11:49.000 --> 01:11:56.000
It's still something to keep in mind, but if you see any kind of a decrease that's 10 or 11 percentage points.

01:11:56.000 --> 01:12:04.000
It's not actually as significant on the commercial side just because it's, you know, we have a much larger margin of error.

01:12:04.000 --> 01:12:18.000
This is just, I'm going to skip over a couple of these pages, just a guide to reading the report at your leisure. And I'll skip over our key study findings because We're going to go through all of this information in more depth with some much more visually appealing slides.

01:12:18.000 --> 01:12:24.000
So with that, we'll start off kind of our first section is satisfaction with the DPU services.

01:12:24.000 --> 01:12:42.000
And what we have here is our list of organizational characteristics. We use these on a national level in all of our utility surveys. You'll see the column on the far right is our public power data source tool, of which the DPU is a subscriber. And so this is national data from public power customers across the country.

01:12:42.000 --> 01:12:49.000
And so we use this as kind of a comparison point where applicable to kind of show how you're stacking up compared to similar utilities across the country.

01:12:49.000 --> 01:13:08.000
And the positive news is the DPU is performing very well. You'll see the average rating overall is significantly higher than what we see at a national level and pretty much across the board, we're seeing higher ratings for the DPU compared to what we see nationally. So really positive things there across the board.

01:13:08.000 --> 01:13:23.000
The other thing to note here is that we saw a lot of very consistent ratings compared to what we saw in 2024. So you'll see the average rating for commercial customers average rating for residential customers only varied within about a percentage point. So nothing all that significant.

01:13:23.000 --> 01:13:35.000
Where we saw a couple of different shifts. So on the residential side, we saw more customers having a positive opinion of the DPU providing good service and value for the cost. So that's essentially our question to get at.

01:13:35.000 --> 01:13:43.000
The rates that you pay. So we always like to see ratings for that number going up. Obviously, it's a very key indicator of overall satisfaction as well.

01:13:43.000 --> 01:14:02.000
We saw slight decreases in ratings for communicating with customers. So we do have some of our recommendations at the end kind of address how we're communicating with customers and as we'll see in a couple of slides, customers are really increasingly preferring digital communication, which should come as no surprise.

01:14:02.000 --> 01:14:11.000
We have a couple of recommendations about that as well. On the commercial side, we saw higher ratings for overall satisfaction, up by about nine percentage points.

01:14:11.000 --> 01:14:20.000
But we saw slightly lower ratings for the efforts of the DPU to help customers conserve electricity, gas, and water. Again, while it declined by 13 percentage points.

01:14:20.000 --> 01:14:30.000
Keeping in mind our margin of error is 20%. So it's actually not a statistically significant decrease, but just something to keep in mind.

01:14:30.000 --> 01:14:51.000
So we look at our reasons for any poor ratings. The good news is not a lot of customers gave poor ratings. So we use just kind of a count of those. And this is a open-ended response questions. So when we coded these on the residential side, reasons for poor ratings largely surrounded cost and pricing. That's always going to be one of your top

01:14:51.000 --> 01:15:04.000
Answer options, no matter of any rate increases that you've gone through. Poor communication and lack of information was another top response for a lot of residential customers. So again, we have some recommendations surrounding communication as well.

01:15:04.000 --> 01:15:15.000
On the commercial side, the reasons, you know, it's only a handful of respondents, obviously, but they surrounded things like poor customer service and support, and some folks mentioned billing issues as well.

01:15:15.000 --> 01:15:33.000
Those were the top two commercial responses. So the next couple of slides are really focused on breaking into the DPU services and kind of evaluating them one by one. And so our first kind of criteria is the quality of the service received.

01:15:33.000 --> 01:15:55.000
And so we do define quality because it is a very broad term. And we've asked this question the past couple of years in the survey and gotten some uncertain responses from customers about what we mean by quality. So we defined it as a measure of safety, maintenance, utility system infrastructure and customer service that really goes into that kind of holistic view of the quality of your service.

01:15:55.000 --> 01:16:11.000
So a couple of positive things here. You'll see the red bars are our residential ratings. The blue bars are our commercial readings. And so on the commercial side, the big thing is natural gas and wastewater, all commercial customers who receive those services gave a positive rating for the quality.

01:16:11.000 --> 01:16:18.000
Those were increases over what we saw in 2024. On the residential side, largely consistent ratings. We saw, you know.

01:16:18.000 --> 01:16:24.000
Satisfaction was over 90% for all services. So that's the really positive takeaway there.

01:16:24.000 --> 01:16:36.000
Where we saw decreases, it was by about one or two percentage points. So nothing astronomical by any means. And still all very positive ratings across the board.

01:16:36.000 --> 01:16:59.000
And then now looking at satisfaction with the rate paid for the quality of service received, usually an area where we see lower ratings because we're taking into account your rates, your utility bill. We did see some positive results here on the residential side, improved ratings for natural gas when it comes to the rate paid for natural gas service for the quality of service received. That went up significantly.

01:16:59.000 --> 01:17:16.000
In 2025. So good news on that front. Otherwise, we saw pretty consistent ratings across the other residential services with just very slight fluctuations. On the commercial side, we actually saw slightly increased ratings.

01:17:16.000 --> 01:17:23.000
By a couple percentage points for each of these services. And generally speaking, higher satisfaction on the commercial side.

01:17:23.000 --> 01:17:51.000
Largely speaking, numbers are moving in the right direction. And then lastly, the reliability of services received. So again, seeing largely ratings of 90% or higher for most of the services when we talk about reliability. And this is obviously a key area where we saw a couple of slides ago, reliability is usually one of the strongest rated characteristics for any municipal utility and the DPU is no exception by any means.

01:17:51.000 --> 01:17:57.000
So we see really, really high ratings, especially when it comes to reliability of water services, natural gas services.

01:17:57.000 --> 01:18:10.000
Across the board, again, where we saw slight fluctuations, it was within a couple percentage points. And we did see some improved ratings on the commercial side. Again, where natural gas and wastewater reliability ratings went up to 100%.

01:18:10.000 --> 01:18:19.000
Compared to being in the high 80s last year. So definitely some improvements on the commercial side. Again, even though we're looking at a smaller sample size.

01:18:19.000 --> 01:18:42.000
And really high ratings across the board for reliability. So next is what we call our net positive score. So not to be confused with a net promoter score. This is our question for kind of gauging the overall relationship that customers have with their utility company. And so we put together this, what we call an NP plus S score, which is the sum of

01:18:42.000 --> 01:18:47.000
Customers who identified as being an advocate of their utility company or a satisfied customer.

01:18:47.000 --> 01:19:00.000
Just excluding anyone basically was a less than satisfied customer or who was unsure And so on the residential side, we actually saw slightly improved ratings here. Our residential NP plus S score was a 79.9%.

01:19:00.000 --> 01:19:05.000
And then on the commercial side, our NP plus S score was an 85.7%.

01:19:05.000 --> 01:19:28.000
Really strong ratings here. We don't have the specific data point in here, but when we look at this question nationally, usually our NP plus S is somewhere around 80%. So the DPU scores are really right on par with what we see nationally. Obviously, the goal is to convert more folks from being just a satisfied customer to being an advocate of the utility and having that really strong positive relationship.

01:19:28.000 --> 01:19:37.000
But again, that usually comes over time and just developing that stronger relationship with the utility company.

01:19:37.000 --> 01:19:47.000
So looking at organizational citizenship, this is another question in the survey that we've sort of tinkered with over the years because We found that a lot of customers don't know what the word organizational citizenship means.

01:19:47.000 --> 01:19:59.000
So we've tried to define it a little bit more simply as overall satisfaction with the DPU being environmentally, socially, and financially responsible.

01:19:59.000 --> 01:20:29.000
Again, we do find that this is a concept that a lot of customers don't really think about too much with respect to their utility company. So that's why you see about a quarter of residential customers being unsure of how to rate the organizational citizenship as a criteria just because they haven't likely really thought about it too much. So that is something that definitely skews the satisfaction ratings where we're looking at just under two thirds said that they're satisfied with the organizational citizenship of the DPU. Again, a lot of that is folks who said, don't know, unsure versus

01:20:29.000 --> 01:20:36.000
Actually being dissatisfied by any means. So that's just one thing to note as well.

01:20:36.000 --> 01:20:41.000
We'll get into customer service and I'll pass things over to my colleague, Sophia for the section.

01:20:41.000 --> 01:20:49.000
All right. Thank you so much, Catherine. Hi, everyone. My name is Sophia Vegeta. I'll be taking you through the customer service and communication sections.

01:20:49.000 --> 01:20:58.000
So first, we're just going to start out with customer satisfaction with the customer service department and their purpose of contact that they had with the DPU.

01:20:58.000 --> 01:21:11.000
So we saw that customer service satisfaction ratings actually increased in 2025 with at least eight out of 10 surveyed residential and commercial customers being satisfied with the service provided by the customer service department.

01:21:11.000 --> 01:21:20.000
And we saw that this also outperformed the public power data source average as well, which was 81.2% in 2024.

01:21:20.000 --> 01:21:26.000
Compared to that 86.9% from the DPU's customers that you guys saw in 2025.

01:21:26.000 --> 01:21:39.000
And then among those residential customers who have contacted the DPU in the last year, we saw that this was primarily for a billing question followed by a trash recycling concern or a water service problem.

01:21:39.000 --> 01:21:48.000
While over one quarter of commercial customers reported contacting the DPU for a billing question as well.

01:21:48.000 --> 01:21:54.000
And then when looking at customers perception of the customer service department's issue resolution.

01:21:54.000 --> 01:22:08.000
We saw that over three-fifths of residential customers and two-thirds of commercial customers indicated that their questions or issues that they came to the customer service department with was taken care of the first time. And this was right in line with the

01:22:08.000 --> 01:22:18.000
For the residential customers with the 2024 findings, we saw only a 0.2% increase this time around, but we saw a little bit more of an increase on the commercial customer side.

01:22:18.000 --> 01:22:30.000
With 66.7% of commercial customers being satisfied and having their issues taken care of the first time compared to 2024.

01:22:30.000 --> 01:22:35.000
And then when looking at customers experience, specifically with a field service representative over the past year.

01:22:35.000 --> 01:22:42.000
We saw that satisfaction with the DPU's field representatives increased for both residential and commercial customers in 2025.

01:22:42.000 --> 01:22:53.000
With approximately four-fifths of both customer bases reporting satisfaction. We also saw that among customers who indicated a field representative visited their home or business in the last 12 months.

01:22:53.000 --> 01:23:01.000
The most common reason among both customer bases was for a meter reading.

01:23:01.000 --> 01:23:05.000
And then next we will get into the communication and awareness section.

01:23:05.000 --> 01:23:12.000
So first we just start out with the customer's awareness of the DPU's community ownership.

01:23:12.000 --> 01:23:18.000
So as you can see, we saw that a vast majority of residential customers and commercial customers correctly identified the DPU.

01:23:18.000 --> 01:23:37.000
As a community owned municipal utility. And similarly, this also far outperformed the public power data source and those customers who indicated that their own utility was community owned at 41.3% in 2024 so that was a really big difference there when looking at the DPUs customers.

01:23:37.000 --> 01:23:54.000
And then we also saw that additionally nine out of 10 residential customers and commercial customers indicated that it is either very or somewhat important to maintain this local control of their municipal utility with a higher percentage of commercial customers finding this important compared to 2024 and

01:23:54.000 --> 01:24:02.000
A slight increase in residential customers indicating this in 2025.

01:24:02.000 --> 01:24:19.000
And then when looking at customers communication preferences, their current method of communication versus their preferred, we saw that the most common methods of receiving information among residential customers were through bill inserts and email. It was right in line with

01:24:19.000 --> 01:24:28.000
Their current method of communication that they had in 2024. And then we saw that nearly two-fifths of surveyed residential customers preferred to receive information about the DPU.

01:24:28.000 --> 01:24:38.000
Through email. But we also saw the residential side that there was a significant increase in residential customers who had their current method of communication as male.

01:24:38.000 --> 01:24:48.000
And then we also saw that an increase, well, it was only 10.9% of residential customers in 2025 who actually preferred mail. That was also a significant increase compared to 2024.

01:24:48.000 --> 01:25:04.000
And then when looking at the commercial customers, we saw that the most common method among them was receiving information through the mail, while nearly one half of commercial customers reported a preference for email communication.

01:25:04.000 --> 01:25:26.000
And then we're looking at the customer satisfaction with the frequency and quality of communication that they receive from the DPU, We saw that a majority of customer bases indicated the frequency at which they receive information from the DPU is about right. This also far outperformed on the residential side, the public power data source and those customers who

01:25:26.000 --> 01:25:32.000
Indicated that the frequency of information that they receive is about right from their utility at 74.8%.

01:25:32.000 --> 01:25:38.000
And it's also reflected an increase among both residential and commercial customers compared to 2024.

01:25:38.000 --> 01:25:50.000
And then when looking at the quality of communication, we saw that a majority of residential and and commercial customers reported being satisfied with the quality of communication they received from the DPU.

01:25:50.000 --> 01:26:00.000
With slightly more commercial customers being satisfied with that communication they receive from the DPU compared to 2024.

01:26:00.000 --> 01:26:05.000
And then next we'll get into some of the DPU's digital self-service options.

01:26:05.000 --> 01:26:10.000
This first one that we're looking at is the customer satisfaction with the Los Alamos Now app.

01:26:10.000 --> 01:26:16.000
And as you can see, this was added in 2025 as we don't have any 2024 data to compare it to.

01:26:16.000 --> 01:26:24.000
But for these ones, we saw that over one third of residents and three-fifths of commercial customers were aware of the Los Alamos app.

01:26:24.000 --> 01:26:32.000
Or the looks almost now app. And we also saw that, interestingly, almost one half of residential customers were not at all aware.

01:26:32.000 --> 01:26:44.000
Of the app. And this was kind of reflected in the actual usage of the app. We saw that roughly 14% of residential and commercial customers have actually reported using Los Alamos Now app.

01:26:44.000 --> 01:26:56.000
But among those customers who have used the app, we saw that over three quarters of residents and all commercial customers reported being either very or somewhat satisfied with it.

01:26:56.000 --> 01:27:18.000
And then next, we'll get into customer satisfaction with bill and payment portal. So we saw that over one half of residential customers and three fifths of commercial customers reported using the bill and payment portal. And then among those respondents who have used the bill and payment portal, over four fifths of both customer bases reported being satisfied with their experience using it.

01:27:18.000 --> 01:27:38.000
And then over here, we also dug a little bit deeper into the ages of the respondents, and we saw that significantly more respondents, 54 years of age or younger, reported utilizing the bill and payment portal compared to residents 55 years of age or older.

01:27:38.000 --> 01:27:43.000
And lastly, we look at the customer satisfaction with the automated metering portal.

01:27:43.000 --> 01:27:50.000
So we saw that less than one quarter of residential and just one commercial customer reported using the automated metering portal.

01:27:50.000 --> 01:28:02.000
But of those customers that have used it, we saw that nearly nine out of 10 residents and one business reported being satisfied with their experience using it.

01:28:02.000 --> 01:28:03.000
And with that, I will pass it back to Catherine for the carbon neutral section.

01:28:03.000 --> 01:28:19.000
Great. Thank you. Yes. So thanks, Sophia. So, you know, like I mentioned earlier, these were some questions we added into this year's survey. And we're really excited that we did. You know, we do have some national data on a lot of these questions too, but

01:28:19.000 --> 01:28:30.000
We wanted to focus really on what do the DPU's customers think about different initiatives that the utility is undertaking to really reduce CO2 emissions.

01:28:30.000 --> 01:28:40.000
First question is just getting a sense of how important is it that the DPU really prioritize reducing CO2 emissions in the electric portfolio?

01:28:40.000 --> 01:28:48.000
And we do see that the majority of customers find it important, more so on the commercial side, which was really interesting. About nine out of 10 commercial customers think that this is important.

01:28:48.000 --> 01:29:07.000
Compared to about two thirds of residential customers. So there's certainly some customers, about a quarter of residential customers that don't prioritize this as much, which is something to keep in mind as far as Obviously, different customers have different priorities and there is certainly educational opportunities there as well with those who just don't place as much importance on it.

01:29:07.000 --> 01:29:24.000
What was really interesting is we also dug a little bit deeper into the ages of customers that tend to prioritize the reduction of carbon dioxide emissions. And it was surprisingly more residents who are 55 years or older, about 70% of those residents.

01:29:24.000 --> 01:29:39.000
Do find it important that the TPU prioritize reducing carbon dioxide emissions compared to those 54 or younger was about 58%. So there was about almost a 13 percentage point difference between those two age groups, which was really interesting to see.

01:29:39.000 --> 01:29:55.000
Where the priorities of folks are at. And then we take it a step further to really look at, you know, what does support look like for the GPU investing in efforts to reduce carbon emissions through investing in more clean energy options.

01:29:55.000 --> 01:30:07.000
So overall level of support, a little over three quarters of commercial customers and a little over three fifths of residential customers do support the DPU making these investments in clean energy to reduce CO2 emissions.

01:30:07.000 --> 01:30:14.000
Even though knowing obviously keeping in mind that this may result in electric rate increases.

01:30:14.000 --> 01:30:33.000
And so, you know, again, when we look at these types of questions and we see the level of support that's obviously taking into account that we're looking at something that would increase your monthly bill and not everyone's going to be behind that, even though they might think that it's an important initiative, it's not always feasible for everyone to allocate more money on a monthly basis for these types of initiatives.

01:30:33.000 --> 01:30:43.000
And we do see that coming across in the next question on the right, the amount that folks are willing to actually spend on their electric bill for these clean energy investments.

01:30:43.000 --> 01:30:50.000
About a third of both customer bases said $0 per month. And so that's actually really typical to see with these types of questions.

01:30:50.000 --> 01:30:56.000
We ask these types of questions in a lot of different surveys and usually it is actually around 30 to 35% that just say.

01:30:56.000 --> 01:31:03.000
You know what, I, you know, I can't really swing and I'm not really willing to pay any additional amount.

01:31:03.000 --> 01:31:15.000
Per month on my bill for these initiatives. But what we did see was that about a third of residential customers were willing to pay some amount between you know, a dollar to $10 more per month on their bill.

01:31:15.000 --> 01:31:29.000
Which can certainly go a long way. So that is something to note, as well as the over a quarter of commercial customers are willing to pay $20 or more per month Obviously, folks who have much more substantial utility bills compared to the residential side.

01:31:29.000 --> 01:31:44.000
And again, this is a quarter of 21 respondents. So it's not actually a quarter of the commercial customer base, but there definitely is that willingness there, even though there is about a third of customers who just are willing to.

01:31:44.000 --> 01:31:54.000
And then similar line of questioning, but we asked about overall support for the DPU accelerating its goals to reduce carbon dioxide emissions. Again, if doing so, increase your electric bill.

01:31:54.000 --> 01:32:20.000
So similarly, a little over three quarters of commercial customers are in support of this compared to just a little over half of residential customers are in support of this. So again, we saw the numbers go down a little bit here for a level of support because now we're talking about actually accelerating goals and That tends to not be as much of a priority for the average customer as simply the act of investing in clean energy as a whole.

01:32:20.000 --> 01:32:29.000
And again, we do still see about a third of residential customers not willing to spend any additional money to help the DPU accelerate its goals.

01:32:29.000 --> 01:32:37.000
Compared to about a quarter of our commercial customers. Again, we do still have some customers that are willing to spend, you know.

01:32:37.000 --> 01:33:00.000
Slight additional amounts, you know, one to less than $5 per month or five to less than $10 per month to help with these initiatives. So there certainly is a level of interest out there with some customer profiles. But again, you're always going to have some customers that don't prioritize this as much and aren't necessarily willing to spend any extra amount on their bill for these initiatives because of that.

01:33:00.000 --> 01:33:12.000
And so we'll wrap things up with our considerations. So like I mentioned before, we did want to have one that was a little bit more communication oriented. So we saw this as one of the few areas of decreased ratings in this year's survey.

01:33:12.000 --> 01:33:38.000
And so we added questions into this year's survey about the Los Alamos Now app. And my understanding is that's a relatively new app too. So you have to kind of look at some of the awareness ratings and usage ratings with a little bit of a grain of salt because Obviously, when anything's new, it does tend to take a little while for it to be rolled out to everyone for usage. And I think what's really important to take into consideration here as well is that

01:33:38.000 --> 01:33:45.000
Any kind of a new app or technology. If customers are really used to doing certain things the way that they've always done them.

01:33:45.000 --> 01:34:06.000
They can be less likely to want to change and adopt a new process. But one thing that really stood out to us was that awareness was decently high considering that Again, this is a relatively new app, but usage was obviously a lot lower. But those who have used the app are very satisfied with their experience with it.

01:34:06.000 --> 01:34:17.000
There's definitely positive sentiment from the current users. And so much of this is, how can we get more folks to actually adopt this app and use it for things like bill payment and looking at information and things like that.

01:34:17.000 --> 01:34:22.000
We listed a couple of different actionable insights around communication about the app.

01:34:22.000 --> 01:34:46.000
Sometimes, you know, what we've seen with a lot of our surveys is that customers just need a little bit of direction about how to register, how to sign on, what the what the process really looks like. Not every app is intuitive for every customer. So having some of that guidance can really go a long way. We also, you know, one thing that we've done in the past with some of these apps is what we call a UX test or a user experience test where

01:34:46.000 --> 01:35:16.000
You really dive into the functionality of an app or a website or something like that and will recruit actual customers to kind of go through the processes of the app and complete certain tasks like, hey, look for this information and we'll actually look and see how long does it take the customer to find certain pieces of information or complete a certain task or things like that. So those can be really interesting just to understand, is the reason for low usage that people can't figure out how to use it or is it just that they don't know about it? And is it more of a communication piece?

01:35:17.000 --> 01:35:20.000
That was kind of one area of focus that we had.

01:35:20.000 --> 01:35:38.000
And the second one is really surrounding those clean energy initiatives that we were just talking about. Again, these were new questions to this year's survey. And what was really interesting is that clean energy initiatives are generally a priority for most customers, but We did see some interesting differences based on age. And so we think that there's

01:35:38.000 --> 01:35:44.000
Really an educational opportunity when it comes to these initiatives that the DPU is undergoing. Obviously.

01:35:44.000 --> 01:35:57.000
Greater awareness of these initiatives can really go a long way as far as boosting overall satisfaction. But building and driving support for these initiatives could be really key to seeing their success. And again.

01:35:57.000 --> 01:36:10.000
Improving overall satisfaction moving forward as well with the DPU. So, you know, we have some recommendations surrounding communication and how to get the word out about clean energy initiatives and really increase that support and buy-in from customers, especially those younger customers, because

01:36:10.000 --> 01:36:28.000
Obviously, at some point they'll make up the majority of the customer base. So obviously their buy-in and support is really key. So those were kind of our considerations for this year's survey. As you saw, we a lot of really consistent ratings compared to 2024 and some notable increases as well.

01:36:28.000 --> 01:36:33.000
But yeah, love to open up the floor to any questions that you all have at this point.

01:36:33.000 --> 01:36:40.000
Well, thank you very much to both of you. Lots of information there to try to absorb.

01:36:40.000 --> 01:36:52.000
So I'll ask the board who has absorbed enough that you've got questions Matt. Sure. Thanks. Like you said, it's a lot to digest. I really appreciate all the work that went into this.

01:36:52.000 --> 01:37:06.000
My question is actually pretty easy, I think. And maybe you missed, maybe you addressed it and i missed it it looked like the number of respondents from 2024 to 2025 dropped by about half, both in commercial, which is small numbers, but also in residential.

01:37:06.000 --> 01:37:08.000
Did you talk about that or that that seemed pretty notable to me.

01:37:08.000 --> 01:37:38.000
Yeah, definitely an issue that we saw in this year's survey. We do this survey on an annual basis, and I believe this was about our Fourth iteration doing this annual survey. And then we also have an ongoing transactional or post-contact survey that we're doing kind of on a regular basis too. So there's certainly the chance that some folks who are having interactions are getting that survey, they're getting this survey. And we think there is a little bit of an element of survey fatigue that goes into it, which is why we're hopeful that

01:37:38.000 --> 01:37:51.000
You know, obviously giving it a year between this survey effort and the next survey will have hopefully a little bit less of that survey fatigue. And we can also to kind of look at the time of year that we're fielding the survey.

01:37:51.000 --> 01:37:57.000
Like I mentioned, we typically feel this one in the early part of the year looking at January and February.

01:37:57.000 --> 01:38:23.000
Which tends to be a pretty productive time, but we can always play around with that or look at things like the email campaigns and the language and just how enticing are we making it? I know that Kathy and her team did a lot of outreach as well as our team sent out a lot of a lot of email blasts and such. And we certainly don't want to annoy customers with all of our requests for surveys. So, you know, we obviously respect where some customers are just over surveyed, unfortunately.

01:38:23.000 --> 01:38:31.000
But the two, I think it was 274 residential surveys that we had compared to, you know, usually what we get is around 400 to 500 surveys.

01:38:31.000 --> 01:38:53.000
That is a notable difference. But when you look at things like the margin of error, for example, for this survey, it was about a 5.5% margin of error. If you were going to get another 100 to 200 survey responses, that margin of error is probably going to only go down by about maybe a percentage point. So it is that one of those factors of

01:38:53.000 --> 01:39:10.000
Market research where the more surveys you get, the less that margin of error is actually declining. So, you know, the 274, while it is a smaller number is, you know, from the sense of kind of reliability of data is not astronomically different from what we had last time.

01:39:10.000 --> 01:39:11.000
Fortunately. Yeah.

01:39:11.000 --> 01:39:18.000
That's good. Okay, thanks. Eric. Thank you.

01:39:18.000 --> 01:39:33.000
Okay, so bottom line. When it comes to support for reduction or support for acceleration residentially, over 90% of our customers are not willing to spend over $20 a month more.

01:39:33.000 --> 01:39:34.000
Yeah.

01:39:34.000 --> 01:39:42.000
Now, my back the napkin envelope calculations show that it's going to cost $30,000 per rate payer to work on our infrastructure.

01:39:42.000 --> 01:39:48.000
That's $200 a month for $200 a month 15 years or $100 a month for 30 years.

01:39:48.000 --> 01:40:02.000
Now, I recommend very strongly in your survey that you change the bands to one to fifty dollars fifty one to a hundred 101 to 200 and over 200.

01:40:02.000 --> 01:40:12.000
Because that would give a much cleaner idea of what people are actually willing to spend. You know, it's the whole thing about Do you support it?

01:40:12.000 --> 01:40:17.000
I don't see that as being a very Useful question.

01:40:17.000 --> 01:40:24.000
Because, yeah, I'm going to support it sure 30% of the people who support it say, I'm not going to spend any money to support it.

01:40:24.000 --> 01:40:34.000
So… It's how much money are you willing to pay? In California, electric bills, some of them are higher than the mortgages.

01:40:34.000 --> 01:40:47.000
Prices are absolutely skyrocketing because of this. And so how much are we really willing to pay And that's 90% of our residents say they're not willing to pay more than $20. That's pretty significant.

01:40:47.000 --> 01:41:03.000
Yeah yeah for sure yeah I mean, and that's why we asked the, you know, follow up question of how much you're actually willing to pay. Because like I mentioned, these results actually aren't that different from what we see on a national level. And I think the reality is, again, yeah, most people do support these initiatives. So when you ask them to pay more for it.

01:41:03.000 --> 01:41:18.000
Not as much. And so much of it is you know just you know how you know how difficult is it for customers to pay all of their bills kind of comprehensively aside from their utility bills? And where does that kind of factor into the equation? And I think

01:41:18.000 --> 01:41:32.000
You know, especially when we look at the past two to three years There's a lot of customers that are really struggling to get by, not necessarily in the DPU service territory, but kind of nationwide. So that is, you know, it's not uncommon to see that kind of level of

01:41:32.000 --> 01:41:54.000
Level of willingness overall. I do like the idea of having those larger ranges too. And we can always ask it in different terms of, you know, on a per month basis or looking at kind of per year, whatever is the most helpful metric, but at least this is kind of like a foundation point and we can certainly work and tweak the questions moving forward to get

01:41:54.000 --> 01:41:56.000
More precise insights too.

01:41:56.000 --> 01:42:04.000
And after I came up with my $30,000 per ratepayer number, I'm thinking, okay, that's interesting. I read an article about nationwide electrification.

01:42:04.000 --> 01:42:09.000
And they came up with $32,000 per rate payer across the country. Then I read another article which confirmed the 30,000 number.

01:42:09.000 --> 01:42:12.000
Yeah.

01:42:12.000 --> 01:42:20.000
So I'm really hoping someone can prove me wrong. But um That seems to be a very realistic number at this point.

01:42:20.000 --> 01:42:21.000
Yeah.

01:42:21.000 --> 01:42:24.000
Thank you.

01:42:24.000 --> 01:42:51.000
Okay, on that point. Well before the next survey is done, we actually will have an electrification study in hand that will start to give us some idea of costs for electrifying and either confirm or refine Eric's estimates When you do this next year, we may have a better set of brackets, a more realistic set of brackets to use.

01:42:51.000 --> 01:42:53.000
Yeah.

01:42:53.000 --> 01:43:02.000
May not be zero to 50 and 50 to 100. But I don't know. But we'll have a less of a hand waving basis for it.

01:43:02.000 --> 01:43:15.000
Yeah, that's awesome. Yeah, and anywhere in the survey too, where, you know, we like to say that surveys can be an educational component or educational tool as well. So anywhere where we can educate the customers too of, you know, this is what realistic costs really look like, because again.

01:43:15.000 --> 01:43:31.000
Not every average consumer has a good idea of what the actual costs look like. They're just thinking about their own bottom line of wallets. So we can also, you know, again, if anything comes out of that study that we can use to kind of give us a qualifier to the question, we can incorporate that as well.

01:43:31.000 --> 01:43:32.000
Okay, thank you. Next question.

01:43:32.000 --> 01:43:35.000
Yeah, absolutely.

01:43:35.000 --> 01:43:45.000
When you look at slide your slide 33 It says roughly a third of the respondents, both commercial and residential.

01:43:45.000 --> 01:43:52.000
Were unwilling to spend any additional amount per month to reduce carbon.

01:43:52.000 --> 01:43:59.000
That roughly one third corresponds to those who don't think it's important.

01:43:59.000 --> 01:44:13.000
To reduce carbon so is the is the responses are the responses to that question based on belief that it's not important.

01:44:13.000 --> 01:44:25.000
Wherever that comes from, or is it based on economic considerations that, gee, we just can't afford anything more Or is it we don't want this at all? So of course we're going to say zero.

01:44:25.000 --> 01:44:43.000
Yeah, yeah. What I would say is it's likely a combination of both. Again, just hypothesizing, but when we look at these two questions, you know, these were asked to all customers. So we're not just looking at people who were interested or not interested. I think there's definitely a component of interest level and priority, but also the economic feasibility.

01:44:43.000 --> 01:45:13.000
One other point, and this might actually be a good question for our next survey as well, but we do ask some questions in our surveys where we're asking customers to really prioritize a couple different key aspects of their electric service. So we'll look at things like the rates that you pay, the reliability, carbon will have some kind of element about reducing carbon emissions. We'll have customer service, just other kind of qualities. And we'll ask customers to sort of rank their order of priority of those different characteristics. And pretty much every time we ask that question, unfortunately, reducing carbon emissions becomes that

01:45:17.000 --> 01:45:28.000
Fifth or sixth priority, whereas rates and reliability tend to be at the top and so I think there's some component of that too, where it's, you know, hey, this is important for a lot of customers, but it's not more important than like

01:45:28.000 --> 01:45:51.000
Paying a low electric rate or their customer service quality. It's not the most critical component of their service, unfortunately, for many customers. So again, that might be a helpful question to ask in the next survey just to get an idea of what type of customer are we looking at because you do have customers that really do place a high level of importance on this and those are likely those customers willing to spend more money.

01:45:51.000 --> 01:46:05.000
But it'll be interesting to look at those who are really just, hey, my day-to-day, are my rates good? Is my power on? Are my services working? Those types of customers are likely the ones who aren't putting as much priority on it, unfortunately.

01:46:05.000 --> 01:46:10.000
That sounds like it could be useful. Another useful way of looking at this Could we go back to slide 17 for a moment, please?

01:46:10.000 --> 01:46:17.000
Yeah.

01:46:17.000 --> 01:46:20.000
Sorry if I'm giving anyone a headache by going through this quickly.

01:46:20.000 --> 01:46:21.000
All right.

01:46:21.000 --> 01:46:37.000
Nope. Yeah, the reason What you're showing on this, what is shown on the screen here and what we see in our agenda package the numbers don't add up exactly. I mean, they're not exactly the same.

01:46:37.000 --> 01:46:38.000
Yes.

01:46:38.000 --> 01:46:45.000
And so the differences are not really significant but it's I was wondering which one was the correct one.

01:46:45.000 --> 01:47:01.000
This is the correct one. We actually noticed that issue earlier today. There was a slight glitch in our reporting platform. So the good news is that these numbers are actually I think all higher than what you have in your packet. So if anything, the ratings went up. But yes, these are the correct versions to

01:47:01.000 --> 01:47:11.000
To use and and the same goes for the past three pages.

01:47:11.000 --> 01:47:12.000
All good.

01:47:12.000 --> 01:47:18.000
Okay. Yeah, I wasn't paying any attention. It happened to jump out on this one so Okay. Like I said, it's not an important difference We'd like to keep our numbers straight where we can, or we try anyway.

01:47:18.000 --> 01:47:22.000
Yep. For sure.

01:47:22.000 --> 01:47:28.000
Okay, other questions or comments? I had one too. Philo. Chair.

01:47:28.000 --> 01:47:39.000
I wanted to follow up on Matt's question regarding survey fatigue. I know personally I took three different county surveys over the past couple months when this occurred.

01:47:39.000 --> 01:47:44.000
So I do think there was some fatigue. Associated with that.

01:47:44.000 --> 01:47:53.000
We're going to try to, you know, somehow planning and economic development all these little surveys came out around the same time.

01:47:53.000 --> 01:48:08.000
So hopefully we can avoid that going forward too. And I would mention one other thing. This is a little bit of history. We used to offer green power purchases and we only had about 200 customers that would participate in that.

01:48:08.000 --> 01:48:20.000
So actually when you see these results, it's confirming kind of what who is willing to pay more per month pretty much in that market.

01:48:20.000 --> 01:48:27.000
If you average at me five bucks a month So that's all I had. Thank you. Thank you.

01:48:27.000 --> 01:48:35.000
If there's nothing else, we thank you very much for your work and your presentation.

01:48:35.000 --> 01:48:36.000
Thank you for coming back. We look forward to the next round.

01:48:36.000 --> 01:48:37.000
Oh, absolutely. Thank you for having us again.

01:48:37.000 --> 01:48:39.000
That's great.

01:48:39.000 --> 01:48:40.000
Awesome. Thank you.

01:48:40.000 --> 01:48:56.000
Okay, we now have a couple of Business items, even though it's a work session, so we need to suspend our rules the motion to do that's on page 84 of our agenda doc if someone would care to make that motion. Sure.

01:48:56.000 --> 01:49:05.000
I move that the Board of Public Utilities suspend their procedural rules for the April 2nd 2024 work session so that formal action may be taken.

01:49:05.000 --> 01:49:13.000
Second. Okay. Moved and seconded to suspend the rules Let's see, is that by itself procedural?

01:49:13.000 --> 01:49:18.000
It is. Okay. All in favor?

01:49:18.000 --> 01:49:28.000
All opposed? Okay, motion passes four to zero. Then we move on.

01:49:28.000 --> 01:49:47.000
Approval of modification 24 to the electric coordination agreement And there's actually a handout on the subject that updates the revised motion, the recommended motion And we'll hand this over to Philo for presentation.

01:49:47.000 --> 01:50:09.000
Sure. Chair, members of the board. We meet every six to eight weeks with the Los Alamos power pool which is the laboratory And we met last Thursday and approved this Modification number 24 to add six months to six months

01:50:09.000 --> 01:50:18.000
Current ECA agreement. I think I've formed the board back in the first meeting in February.

01:50:18.000 --> 01:50:31.000
That we receive notification from DOE and Albuquerque that they were not able to deliver a contract for us to review.

01:50:31.000 --> 01:50:45.000
Due to some executive orders. And the most prudent thing to do at this point in time is extend the current agreement we have and work through getting the revised agreement in place.

01:50:45.000 --> 01:50:53.000
For the next 10 years after this. Now, does this mean that we run all the way to the end of the year? No.

01:50:53.000 --> 01:51:03.000
We'll continue to work to try to bring in the new ECA agreement as soon as we can.

01:51:03.000 --> 01:51:09.000
So I'd stand for any questions. Are there any questions?

01:51:09.000 --> 01:51:18.000
Is there any public comment on this subject? I don't see any in chambers. Do we have any online?

01:51:18.000 --> 01:51:29.000
Okay, no public comment on the topic the comments from the board.

01:51:29.000 --> 01:51:48.000
Sure. Filo, maybe you can give us a 30-second elevator elevator talk on the uh on the agreement and you know the um the benefits and the drawbacks for the county.

01:51:48.000 --> 01:52:02.000
In 30 seconds? In 30 seconds. Sure. Well, you know. There's about like three different main pieces, right? So the electricity is brought over on the laboratory's line.

01:52:02.000 --> 01:52:15.000
Into the TA3 substation and then that is distributed. So there's that element of the power lines and distribution.

01:52:15.000 --> 01:52:25.000
Ben's group does all the power scheduling and that's a 24 hours seven day 365 operation.

01:52:25.000 --> 01:52:29.000
It's paid. On a pro rata share.

01:52:29.000 --> 01:52:37.000
So generally the laboratory is about 80 of the load and we're 20%.

01:52:37.000 --> 01:52:56.000
To follow on to that. We also schedule Sandia Kirtland's energy and that's split for the scheduling services so we end up roughly about 10%, Ben, roughly is what we're paying on the scheduling services element of that ECA. That's Probably the big benefit there of the shared

01:52:56.000 --> 01:53:09.000
Scheduling costs and services. And then it's the other pieces are the energy resources brought to the table and Lion's share is done by the county.

01:53:09.000 --> 01:53:30.000
And uh but they have their WAPA. They have a gas combustion turbine on site that is dedicated mostly just to the lab. We don't take energy from it, but should there be a emergency, there's an ability to take some energy if needed.

01:53:30.000 --> 01:53:35.000
But primarily. The energy is from contracts that we procure.

01:53:35.000 --> 01:53:40.000
So that's my 30 seconds. That's really good. So let me ask you.

01:53:40.000 --> 01:53:47.000
If the agreement did not continue. And what would be the implications for the county and the department?

01:53:47.000 --> 01:54:12.000
Well, I think the biggest one is the scheduling services from a staffing and operation as well as the energy we're procured for You know, we have a power purchase agreement for mercuria right now that's 40 megawatts around the clock, what would we do that? And so we'd have to remarket or sell it back to them, whatever it may be.

01:54:12.000 --> 01:54:19.000
Those are the high risk items. So if I can just try to paraphrase, you can tell me if I'm wrong here.

01:54:19.000 --> 01:54:27.000
Okay, so we're supposed to have an electric coordination agreement. We haven't we supposed to have it by now from the lab, but we don't.

01:54:27.000 --> 01:54:33.000
You know, there's a new administration, there's continuing resolution, there's all this other kind of stuff.

01:54:33.000 --> 01:54:40.000
And so basically this is kind of the same things like, okay, we extend the agreement because we got to wait on the lab.

01:54:40.000 --> 01:54:53.000
To do their thing. And so we're just kind of extending it. Does that make sense is that right and however we did get a little We got a little headway last week. Ben's going to present in May.

01:54:53.000 --> 01:55:03.000
The operation components of the agreement that They said they haven't modified any of those terms. So for example.

01:55:03.000 --> 01:55:22.000
Foxtail Flats is in the new ECA. San Juan generating station is not because it's retired. So it's going to be cleaned up, you know, there's 24 modifications here so we're going to boil it all down into a new agreement. That's one agreement and um

01:55:22.000 --> 01:55:40.000
The other piece is sandia kirtlin is in that agreement to they're going to take a quarter of the battery and associated solar that we're purchasing with that PPA.

01:55:40.000 --> 01:55:54.000
So we'll have more in May for you. So I think it's a good way to look at our operations piece and then you can look at the the stuff that's couched in all the legal stuff that Thomas looks at and you really got to rely on him to

01:55:54.000 --> 01:56:02.000
Sift through that piece.

01:56:02.000 --> 01:56:06.000
Other questions or comments?

01:56:06.000 --> 01:56:21.000
Okay, motion. Anyone and this would be the what's on the handout sheet. Yeah, I move that the Board of Public Utilities consent to modification 24 to extend the contract term by six months.

01:56:21.000 --> 01:56:30.000
Of the electric coordination agreement between the incorporated county of los alamos And the Department of Energy and forward to council for approval.

01:56:30.000 --> 01:56:38.000
Second. Okay. Moved and seconded to consent to mod 24 of the ECA.

01:56:38.000 --> 01:56:50.000
Last comments? Kathy, would you please call the roll? Member Heppner? Yes. Member Nochley? Yes. Member Stromberg? Yes. And Member Gibson?

01:56:50.000 --> 01:56:59.000
Yes. Thank you. Motion passes four to zero. Next item on the agenda.

01:56:59.000 --> 01:57:09.000
Is… An amendment to the services. Amendment number one to services agreement, the charge point.

01:57:09.000 --> 01:57:16.000
For purpose of electric vehicle equipment. And operation and maintenance services.

01:57:16.000 --> 01:57:22.000
This is also Philo and Angelica. Yes, Chair, members of the board.

01:57:22.000 --> 01:57:37.000
If you recall back in December the department is going to be managing the revenues And expenses that come from the ChargePoint contract that we had the two fast chargers installed.

01:57:37.000 --> 01:57:47.000
A year and a year, year and a half ago. And this amendment is for the county. It's being paid by the general fund.

01:57:47.000 --> 01:58:06.000
But the agreement came through us. And then it's got a it's a change order and then it'll go to council So, but we're also had that presentation about we'll manage the revenue expenses because of We're an enterprise fund that can do that.

01:58:06.000 --> 01:58:15.000
And so that's why it's before you tonight. Okay, thank you. Questions from the board.

01:58:15.000 --> 01:58:26.000
Eric. So with the $300,000, is there a projected payback on that from the payback of the rates.

01:58:26.000 --> 01:58:42.000
So that's also scheduled in the agenda for May. To review the charges is i know the board asks you know what what are you going to pay You know, so right now we set a charge to try to recover that equipment cost.

01:58:42.000 --> 01:58:46.000
To replace it when it's at the end of its useful life in 10 years.

01:58:46.000 --> 01:58:52.000
So, uh. That's a separate function now.

01:58:52.000 --> 01:58:55.000
You'll see in May. All right, but we do plan on paying it back.

01:58:55.000 --> 01:59:05.000
Okay, thank you very much. Aspirational costs, yes, and capital replacement I presume it's more than just the equipment costs, also the power.

01:59:05.000 --> 01:59:09.000
It would be included in the charge.

01:59:09.000 --> 01:59:17.000
I had one question and maybe it's actually for Thomas, but this is on page 93 in our packet.

01:59:17.000 --> 01:59:28.000
And apologies, but I tried to read through this and read the legalese. So maybe I misread the phraseology but Item J, whatever it is.

01:59:28.000 --> 01:59:44.000
Access, let's see, access Chargepoint, any Chargepoint application or the Chargepoint service for the purpose of monitoring their availability, performance, or functionality and probably the dot, dot, dot gets into it but I read this and it looked like we couldn't

01:59:44.000 --> 01:59:48.000
Use the data we get from them to see if it's on or not.

01:59:48.000 --> 01:59:59.000
And that seemed like an issue I'm sure this is boilerplate or something, but that just looked like It looks like they're trying to limit us from developing our own app that we would then sell to customers.

01:59:59.000 --> 02:00:13.000
But the language in there says including that but without limitation. So I just, I wasn't sure about that term. That looked a little concerning if we can't tell whether it's on or not. That seemed like an issue.

02:00:13.000 --> 02:00:27.000
We should be able to tell whether it's on or not, but there are some limitations on their proprietary software that they that they don't want us to create our own app to do all that. And there's also a privacy concern

02:00:27.000 --> 02:00:36.000
About who's drawing, who's plugging in or not, how long, those kinds of things but Yeah, it kind of is what it is spoilerplate.

02:00:36.000 --> 02:00:45.000
Thanks. The questions.

02:00:45.000 --> 02:00:51.000
Is there any public comment? None in chambers, none online.

02:00:51.000 --> 02:01:01.000
Okay. Further board discussion or motion.

02:01:01.000 --> 02:01:05.000
Don't all speak at once. I'll go ahead and make a motion.

02:01:05.000 --> 02:01:18.000
I move that the Board of Public Utilities approve the amended agreement number AGR 22-931ABC-A1.

02:01:18.000 --> 02:01:26.000
With Chargepoint Incorporated in the amount not to exceed $295,000, 700 From 74 and 29 cents.

02:01:26.000 --> 02:01:33.000
Plus applicable gross receipts tax for the purpose of electric vehicle charging equipment and services.

02:01:33.000 --> 02:01:40.000
From Chargepoint Incorporated. Further move that this request be forwarded to Council for final approval.

02:01:40.000 --> 02:01:52.000
Second. Okay. Moved and seconded that the board approve the proposed amended agreement Any final comments?

02:01:52.000 --> 02:02:00.000
Kathy? Number Hefner. Yes. Member Nockley? Yes. Member Stromberg?

02:02:00.000 --> 02:02:09.000
Yes. And Member Gibson. Yes. Thank you. Thank you. Motion passes four to zero.

02:02:09.000 --> 02:02:19.000
Next item is is also in a… In the handout.

02:02:19.000 --> 02:02:28.000
That's approval of a letter of support Senator Lujan regarding the water production project PM3 replacement.

02:02:28.000 --> 02:02:33.000
The staff report didn't change, but I don't think it did.

02:02:33.000 --> 02:02:53.000
But the letter has been reworked a little bit. So it's the letter that's in your handout that we are proposing to be or asking for approval on here this evening so it can be sent in in a timely manner.

02:02:53.000 --> 02:03:01.000
Is there any questions? Can you just summarize what the change is? I didn't have a chance to read the change.

02:03:01.000 --> 02:03:07.000
I would say there's probably nothing really substantive It's more phraseology.

02:03:07.000 --> 02:03:14.000
I tried to make it a little bit stronger and a little bit more Precise.

02:03:14.000 --> 02:03:22.000
But nothing, I don't believe anything really substantive was changed.

02:03:22.000 --> 02:03:30.000
If there's no questions, is there any public comment? None in chambers.

02:03:30.000 --> 02:03:36.000
Okay, none online.

02:03:36.000 --> 02:03:42.000
Do people want more time to read the letter? Okay. Is there emotion?

02:03:42.000 --> 02:03:48.000
Sure, I move that the Board of Public Utilities approve the letter to Senator Ben Ray Lujan as presented.

02:03:48.000 --> 02:04:11.000
Second. Just to be clear, why don't you make the motion Draft number two letter Or something like that so that we know the record is clear what's being approved. Okay, I move that the board of public utilities approved the letter to Senator Ray Lujan as amended.

02:04:11.000 --> 02:04:16.000
That'll work. That'll work. Second. Okay.

02:04:16.000 --> 02:04:34.000
Moved and seconded the letter be approved. Any further discussion? Kathy? Member Hefner? Yes. Member Nochley? Yes. Member Stromberg? Yes. And Member Gibson? Yes. Thank you.

02:04:34.000 --> 02:04:39.000
Okay, motion passes four to zero. It is a little past 730.

02:04:39.000 --> 02:04:47.000
We have a couple of reports to go yet. Wouldn't the board like to take a break?

02:04:47.000 --> 02:04:51.000
I just think we ought to do it. You want to keep going?

02:04:51.000 --> 02:05:06.000
Sure. Okay. All right. If anybody, keep going, goodbye. Good job, Charlie. I must be a manager.

02:05:06.000 --> 02:05:17.000
Okay. That being the case, let's see here. We are on page 180 of our agenda doc.

02:05:17.000 --> 02:05:26.000
Which is…

02:05:26.000 --> 02:05:35.000
The annual update on our electric reliability plan. Steve Morris.

02:05:35.000 --> 02:05:44.000
Chair gibson and board members, this year's plan is a Instead of continuing modification from every year as we go.

02:05:44.000 --> 02:05:52.000
Let me see if this…

02:05:52.000 --> 02:06:07.000
Hit it. That's the report near the presentation.

02:06:07.000 --> 02:06:15.000
This report covers the distribution system for Los Alamos. Which includes townside and White Rock.

02:06:15.000 --> 02:06:21.000
We'll go over the distribution system, some reliability measures that we take to take.

02:06:21.000 --> 02:06:30.000
Keep our reliability in our system short-term plans and then some long-term plans

02:06:30.000 --> 02:06:41.000
As an overall, the transmission system, the power supply for Los Alamos is fed from the transmission system through Los Alamos National Labs.

02:06:41.000 --> 02:06:47.000
This is a diagram from the labs that illustrates how interconnected we are with the labs.

02:06:47.000 --> 02:07:04.000
Everything is from them. We do have a substation in White Rock that we control, but our Town site power does come from the TA3 substation and town site which was Just recently renovated several years ago.

02:07:04.000 --> 02:07:26.000
Here's a close-up of our town site. That was the TA3. There's the town side here. We have a breaker's TC1 and TC2 are fed from two transformers at the the TA3 substation Feeders 13, 15, and 16 are on tie circuit number one those are

02:07:26.000 --> 02:07:43.000
Primarily the western area and the mesas 14, 17, and 18 are the downtown areas and the eastern area And they are each of those sides are interchangeable. We can back feed circuits with any one of those.

02:07:43.000 --> 02:07:52.000
And then we have a tiebreaker in case we do lose a tie circuit we can restore the town site.

02:07:52.000 --> 02:07:58.000
The configuration of the feeders in the town site are illustrated here.

02:07:58.000 --> 02:08:16.000
The far right is an extra line from LANL, the EA4 line that feeds our water well system and eastgate park And currently we have a contract design out on the EA4 line that crosses the in accessible areas.

02:08:16.000 --> 02:08:21.000
I'm expecting that design to come in here in a month or so.

02:08:21.000 --> 02:08:31.000
And then, as you can tell down below feeder 13, the green area, we have a separate feeders that feed the hospital and the HRL building.

02:08:31.000 --> 02:08:44.000
That is also the small little red line that crosses the canyon there has been, as you know, a problem for us but it's We're on track now to finally get that going.

02:08:44.000 --> 02:08:52.000
We also control Elk Ridge. There it's labeled by the old name Royal Crest.

02:08:52.000 --> 02:09:05.000
Next slide. The White Rock substation oh yeah so we have two transformers We recently built a new metal enclosed switch gear on unit number one.

02:09:05.000 --> 02:09:18.000
It is our reserve transformer. The transformer itself is a 1960s version. It's the top changer on that unit does not automatically operate.

02:09:18.000 --> 02:09:34.000
Working with Dennis Astley. The engineering manager He has some contacts we'll hopefully get some consultants in here, a company to work on that old transfer switch.

02:09:34.000 --> 02:09:54.000
Next. The White Rock Circuit, there's three feeders White Rock No. 3 being the newest of the Elmir door subdivision And those neighborhoods in the end of the report, you probably saw some diagrams many of those subdivisions within White Rock are very old

02:09:54.000 --> 02:10:02.000
It's one of the earlier developments in the county. We adopted the power grid from White Rock from PNM.

02:10:02.000 --> 02:10:08.000
I believe in the early 80s or 70s It has a voltage of 12-47.

02:10:08.000 --> 02:10:17.000
The town side is at a 136. Voltage level that's uh I have to have some different transformers for each utility.

02:10:17.000 --> 02:10:32.000
Most other material items are interchangeable, but transformers are not. Yeah, we're going to some of our recent outages. The very few storms we've had this year caused a couple of problems.

02:10:32.000 --> 02:10:48.000
In the ice and tree limbs. On the power lines, our tree trimming contractors along with our engineering staff have been doing a really good job getting the trees labeled and trimmed.

02:10:48.000 --> 02:10:55.000
You know, knock on wood, but all these heavy windstorms we've been having We've been writing them out fairly well.

02:10:55.000 --> 02:11:02.000
Sadie hasn't taken a big hit due to a big trees in a while.

02:11:02.000 --> 02:11:13.000
We did have an outage recently on Los Pueblos, which was an underground fault. The fuse cutout did not open. It stayed cooking.

02:11:13.000 --> 02:11:19.000
That apparently what happened there caused the recloser to fail on El Gancho.

02:11:19.000 --> 02:11:25.000
And so when the line crew could not operate the recloser, we went into bypass.

02:11:25.000 --> 02:11:31.000
And then they were able to patrol the line, find the real problem at los pueblos.

02:11:31.000 --> 02:11:38.000
So those over 600 customers were out for several hours that night.

02:11:38.000 --> 02:11:45.000
And we're going to have to get out there probably tomorrow to repair that line. They found it. It's faulted underneath the drop inlet.

02:11:45.000 --> 02:11:55.000
So that's going to be a good one. And I have to remind that Los Pueblos is on our project schedule to be ahead of the road projects here 26.

02:11:55.000 --> 02:12:00.000
And 27? Are there still houses that are out in Los Pueblos because of that?

02:12:00.000 --> 02:12:12.000
No, they were all restored by 9 p.m. That evening. I'm glad my lineman did do a thorough patrol after we did bypass the recloser. The mesa came up.

02:12:12.000 --> 02:12:23.000
And so, and with no visual trees on the lines and no drop cutouts. It was assumed everybody was up But they did do a patrol to the end.

02:12:23.000 --> 02:12:29.000
And once they got to Los Pueblos, it was dark so they they found that problem.

02:12:29.000 --> 02:12:44.000
And so they did a good job on that. Here's an example, a contractor in developing the ice rink dug through the three-phase primary So we had to get the crews in there to get the crews to repull.

02:12:44.000 --> 02:12:53.000
Which was a little bit of a process in a confined space, getting that digger in there to help Did they dig through it while it was live?

02:12:53.000 --> 02:13:11.000
Yes. There were locates, but they had done some some they changed the grade of the approach, the new parking lot they're building And there were locates but they I guess when they were doing the grading, they wiped out the locates

02:13:11.000 --> 02:13:15.000
And so the next guy in with a machine, he dug right through it.

02:13:15.000 --> 02:13:23.000
That sounds like it could have been very dangerous. Yeah, it is. Yes, yes. At that point.

02:13:23.000 --> 02:13:29.000
I think the fault current in that area is between four and five thousand amps.

02:13:29.000 --> 02:13:33.000
On a three-phase line.

02:13:33.000 --> 02:13:40.000
One of the projects that's right now going out to bid is the the fault we had on feeder 13.

02:13:40.000 --> 02:13:54.000
That's where we had the fault. I had some delays in that project right now uh lumen is launching a project in that exact area. I was trying to work with them to join projects.

02:13:54.000 --> 02:14:06.000
And so we spent several weeks going back and forth They eventually got their DOT permit so they decided last week to proceed on their own So they will be boring.

02:14:06.000 --> 02:14:23.000
And because we're in the exact same area and it is restricted, having them bore underneath the curb and in the… the shoulder lane to stay out of the way because I need to go pretty much under the sidewalk.

02:14:23.000 --> 02:14:33.000
To avoid existing utilities. And then the project will go from Oppenheimer all the way to Timber Ridge.

02:14:33.000 --> 02:14:40.000
Sadie was doing good at 29 minutes. This was up. I made this before.

02:14:40.000 --> 02:14:44.000
The outage we had several days ago, we're up to 46 minutes now.

02:14:44.000 --> 02:15:00.000
And Sadie, we're still under a benchmark. And I anticipate that um some of the high outages from previous years might help us curve out and stay under 60 minutes

02:15:00.000 --> 02:15:13.000
Our strategies for improving SADI are you know we continue to do root cause analysis for every power outage in the case of Los Pueblos, it's just done old cable, as many of the subdivisions are.

02:15:13.000 --> 02:15:24.000
We do our estimate management program, line inspections Currently, the line crews are doing their single phase inspections. They did their three phase right before winter.

02:15:24.000 --> 02:15:33.000
And so we gather all that information Now that it's been a warm climate area we're looking for critters, digging into boxes.

02:15:33.000 --> 02:15:43.000
That's always a big one. And then try to stay ahead of the new tree growth that's coming up.

02:15:43.000 --> 02:15:55.000
You have a tree trimming Southwest Fire Defense, they do a really good job on our tree trimming we have trimming we have a number of trees on a ski hill we have to get cut to be ahead of the ski hill project.

02:15:55.000 --> 02:15:59.000
In case we don't want anything to happen while that road is blocked.

02:15:59.000 --> 02:16:03.000
And I know we could probably get through, but it might be a process.

02:16:03.000 --> 02:16:18.000
We have a crew that does over a primarily overhead maintenance, another for underground And then another on projects, community projects, new subdivisions They will mix it up according to crew availability.

02:16:18.000 --> 02:16:32.000
You know, we know that we have We had the holiday season and we had hunting season and Now we have spring fever and then the summertime, a lot of these linemen have kids So we do shuffle the cruises.

02:16:32.000 --> 02:16:38.000
As we get rotation in there. The flu season was good.

02:16:38.000 --> 02:16:47.000
I think I was the only one that had a bad run with it. My linemen have been doing pretty good.

02:16:47.000 --> 02:17:00.000
We're currently, I have here we're increasing fault indicators and tracking And then a new three-phase reclosures. I do have two three-phase reclosers ready to install. We'll be installing one here very shortly.

02:17:00.000 --> 02:17:06.000
Since it burned up on one of them. I'm acquiring SCADA system.

02:17:06.000 --> 02:17:12.000
It's not expensive as the water system one is. This is all Schweitzer.

02:17:12.000 --> 02:17:26.000
Our tech components. There'll be one at the main office PC, the PCS5 Town Site Station, White Rock Station, and then currently already have one in the last station.

02:17:26.000 --> 02:17:44.000
We'll have antennas, we'll have their line sensors and our reclosers will all be communicating with the base so we'll be able to see everything from any one of the stations we can see everything and that'll assist our linemen also with the ami system

02:17:44.000 --> 02:18:02.000
They can see outages where the meters are out. And so that'll improve our response time and give them a better idea of what type of equipment they'll have to take out if they do get in an outage call.

02:18:02.000 --> 02:18:20.000
Short-term plans, continue with our asset management. Pole inspections and replacements as part of that replacement, you know, in our budgets, we have subdivisions listed as for you know going through them and replacing them But I'll use some of that money for pull inspection this coming year.

02:18:20.000 --> 02:18:25.000
It's been about five years, which is the cycle we do our poll assessment program.

02:18:25.000 --> 02:18:40.000
To check for below ground rot, cross arm damage And this will also help be good information for broadband project, which will be coming in soon trying to attach to our poles.

02:18:40.000 --> 02:18:56.000
Make sure we're all in good shape. The short term used to be long term now is the last station Currently, we're in the process of getting all of our locates uh the manhole is ready to be delivered.

02:18:56.000 --> 02:19:10.000
Once the locates are done, probably by next week, the contractor that was working on our Oppenheimer project We'll be moving over to the east hammers road We'll begin excavation on the interception of the duck bank.

02:19:10.000 --> 02:19:26.000
Once I have a contractor that the The general county has a contract with an asbestos mitigation contractor We'll build a task order with him to mitigate the the section of duck bank we have to pull out And then we'll drop the manhole in and

02:19:26.000 --> 02:19:31.000
Begin pulling cable. When we do this, the hospital will be on feeder 13.

02:19:31.000 --> 02:19:49.000
We'll switch the ski hill over to the Llano line. And then we'll try to restore the S6 and SM6 lines first because there's already cable in those conduits we can pull through better. And then we'll work on pulling the remaining cable

02:19:49.000 --> 02:20:04.000
Well, we have some plans here. I need to get with my crews. We'll have asbestos detectors, the sensors We'll flood the manhole, the pipes and use lubricant with all measures to make sure there's no asbestos dust.

02:20:04.000 --> 02:20:20.000
We have ventilation systems that we use in our manholes. And our rescue systems and so we'll rescue we'll have a good safety plan that the entire crew will go over agree to go over Because any one of them has the ability to stop a project

02:20:20.000 --> 02:20:34.000
If they don't feel it's safe. And so we'll make sure it's safe I've communicated with our risk department and uh And they're aware of it. And so we'll pass it. I'll pass it by them one more time, our plan before we begin.

02:20:34.000 --> 02:20:45.000
I've talked to Llano lineman have the sensors and do that work. And according to them in the projects they've done, their sensors have never gone off.

02:20:45.000 --> 02:20:51.000
So I don't wonder if I need to buy the same sensor or a better one.

02:20:51.000 --> 02:21:06.000
So that's the status of the last project. See, the last project will provide for new feeders that will break 13, 15, and 16 into two pieces.

02:21:06.000 --> 02:21:14.000
Currently, the The S6 line will be a brand new line for the hospital. Sm6.

02:21:14.000 --> 02:21:23.000
Will feed the HRL building, but it will also provide a backup that will feed through the heat.

02:21:23.000 --> 02:21:32.000
Feedback feeder 13. And then the S18 will be our next phases of the asset transfer program.

02:21:32.000 --> 02:21:39.000
East Hamaders Road. And then also across the camp.

02:21:39.000 --> 02:21:45.000
To feed Eastgate and Randia Canyon. It'll be an additional tie to the EA4.

02:21:45.000 --> 02:21:53.000
And then S3 line will pick up the eco station and the concrete plant.

02:21:53.000 --> 02:21:59.000
And there's just a briefing of what I just went over there.

02:21:59.000 --> 02:22:14.000
This configuration of the new feeders once the last station is is adopted. You can see the feeders are broken up into smaller pieces, so more redundancy What is more reliable.

02:22:14.000 --> 02:22:30.000
And the ability to back feed. Currently, the way that a lot of these feeders are in the mesa the capacity of the conductors is close to capacity you know the look the demand is close to capacity And so back feeding one feeder with another

02:22:30.000 --> 02:22:37.000
Is depending on the season And the climate is getting pretty risky.

02:22:37.000 --> 02:22:48.000
Because if we have you know a problem, we'll lose both feeders So this configuration will be of great benefit.

02:22:48.000 --> 02:22:56.000
Long-term plans, as you know, the electrification study that's underway. With Burns and McDonald.

02:22:56.000 --> 02:23:01.000
You had that town hall meeting, which, you know. Not very many.

02:23:01.000 --> 02:23:18.000
Townspeople came up, but it was very informative. The scope, the phases of the scope of the project. They'll quantify the market assess everything that we have in the system you know basically we've already begun that.

02:23:18.000 --> 02:23:28.000
Mr. Astley is working on the milsoft model. And he's brought it up to speed quite a bit from where it needs to be.

02:23:28.000 --> 02:23:33.000
I believe soon they'll have it to have it start conducting simulations.

02:23:33.000 --> 02:23:43.000
On the system, we can determine, you know, simulate future loads And determine if and when conductors need to be upgraded.

02:23:43.000 --> 02:23:56.000
They'll adopt some scenarios. They're going to adopt three scenarios. They'll be on the next slide they're showing on how possible adoption or phases of adoption would be.

02:23:56.000 --> 02:24:07.000
And then the grid system impacts you know what what exactly do we anticipate happening uh what type of loading that ties into Angelica's EV plan.

02:24:07.000 --> 02:24:20.000
That's kind of what they're also doing. What are they going to anticipate needing And then this will kind of loop it around and say, what are we going to need to do to make it happen?

02:24:20.000 --> 02:24:27.000
Maybe the possible adoption methods of low electrification, medium and high.

02:24:27.000 --> 02:24:40.000
The first electrification is pretty much what we do now. You know, we're doing phase balancing We're trying to make sure that line rebuilds and reconductors are done.

02:24:40.000 --> 02:25:02.000
As needed, we've reconducted over the past decade or so. A lot of the main primary lines and through the town site And then White Rock, several neighborhoods No, we did improve the conductors all the way out to Monterey South, which is the main feeder on nm4

02:25:02.000 --> 02:25:08.000
But the inner subdivisions are up. Lacenda Piedra Loop is coming up now.

02:25:08.000 --> 02:25:13.000
Will be up for bid shortly. That's on our capital list.

02:25:13.000 --> 02:25:30.000
Medium electrification that's where System reconfiguration that falls into the last project news stations or modular stations is uh something that, you know, they'll have to bring up In previous years.

02:25:30.000 --> 02:25:41.000
Probably 10 years ago, we started proposing a new substation on eastgate But that would require transmission across the canyon, which I don't believe nano would.

02:25:41.000 --> 02:25:55.000
You want us to do. Other options that have recently come up are, you know, ties with the pueblo Coming up Randia Canyon with if they were to build a solar field and bring us a transmission grade.

02:25:55.000 --> 02:26:02.000
And or substation grade, but it would be a new feed Upper India Canyon, which would be beneficial to us.

02:26:02.000 --> 02:26:14.000
And then retail pressure, you know, that's on our plate right now, time of use and our demand charges That will help us smooth out the demand. That will help.

02:26:14.000 --> 02:26:41.000
And then high level, we'll go back into high level new stations, load control you know, communities communities that already have advanced metering systems that have load control And then… direct you know control you know more batteries more solar So by voltage conversion, do you mean like from 15 kV to 34.5?

02:26:41.000 --> 02:26:59.000
What do you mean? That would be if say if the Pueblos were to come with a new transmission, you know, depending on what voltage they have a transmission, we would have to have a substation to To knock it down. Yeah, but I mean, just like distribution around Los Alamos. I never considered that until I saw the words voltage conversion

02:26:59.000 --> 02:27:15.000
Is there any talk about going to 34.5? No, not yet. They've mentioned it, but they haven't come up with any Any suggestions yet? Okay.

02:27:15.000 --> 02:27:24.000
The deliverables, these are in the report. Basically, they're assessing the conditions They'll come up with draft report.

02:27:24.000 --> 02:27:38.000
They'll provide… a final report, they're going to come up with plans that are 15 and 30 year And they'll bring it to us for review and comment. We still have several meetings.

02:27:38.000 --> 02:27:44.000
Board presentations that they'll go through. Then we can look through that.

02:27:44.000 --> 02:27:48.000
See if we agree on it. Next slide.

02:27:48.000 --> 02:28:08.000
I don't know. Our solar has slowed down quite a bit since the rate change. We're only getting maybe two two every one a week, two every other week some of the contractors are our new contractors uh some of them

02:28:08.000 --> 02:28:23.000
Positive energy and some of the other larger scale solar companies haven't haven't been hitting permits. We're getting some from Albuquerque that are smaller units but it so it has slowed down quite a bit.

02:28:23.000 --> 02:28:29.000
A future outlook, planning for the future depends on what the study has.

02:28:29.000 --> 02:28:48.000
The COVID crisis and now trade tariffs and the disasters you know california burning The latest quote for or PO I have out for single phase transformers is one year out three-phase cans. I've gotten several reconditioned that I got in within six months.

02:28:48.000 --> 02:28:56.000
Just received two received two received two large transformers that I had ordered early on for the level three chargers.

02:28:56.000 --> 02:29:03.000
And now they're installing level two chargers. So when they do get around, well, one of them will be used for the bus, the transit buses.

02:29:03.000 --> 02:29:15.000
That are also planned. And so I'll have two spares. One of them I keep as a system spare, but I'll have one extra for the level threes when they get around to doing that.

02:29:15.000 --> 02:29:26.000
I have single phase transformers sufficient to to support level two chargers and And several of the subdivisions that are going on now.

02:29:26.000 --> 02:29:34.000
Los Arbales that's coming in now as a very high density subdivision up on the mesa.

02:29:34.000 --> 02:29:42.000
That one. That one is going to be high demand and very challenging. The transformers on those, like I said.

02:29:42.000 --> 02:29:59.000
Will take a year to get in. Costs syrup, again, as you know, and especially with the tariffs, the cost of metals is going up so I haven't seen the exact numbers yet but It is coming. Also, well, I guess it affects everything

02:29:59.000 --> 02:30:12.000
Current projects now have For example, bathtub row, we just went over that contractors charging $95 a foot for uh four inch conduit.

02:30:12.000 --> 02:30:18.000
So in the back of this report, there's a number of maps showing the age of the subdivisions.

02:30:18.000 --> 02:30:26.000
So you can, given the price of the projects we're doing now, each one of those little subdivisions will cost a million dollars.

02:30:26.000 --> 02:30:32.000
So with the increase in costs. To begin an aggressive program.

02:30:32.000 --> 02:30:50.000
A replacement, you'd probably need about $30 million over 10 years And that breaks down to break down probably around $25, $30 a month per customer And so it's going to take some money.

02:30:50.000 --> 02:30:59.000
Every one of these subdivisions that we're showing here is direct buried Small cable, you know, well, it was small It was good for the uses at the time.

02:30:59.000 --> 02:31:07.000
But so we can expect with the increased load we're going to have more faults Especially if we get a good wet season.

02:31:07.000 --> 02:31:17.000
Our good frozen season the next winter. The drone starts heaving will start having quite a few outages.

02:31:17.000 --> 02:31:42.000
The electric vehicle impacts i think Angelica Study covers that what she was saying the line sensors that I'm going to be installing now will give me a real-time look at the feeders that have the most EV, I'm starting with those feeders. And I can see if we have any reverse flow on those.

02:31:42.000 --> 02:31:58.000
I'm working with T&D and with Burns and mcdonald to And with Mr. Astley here come up with a plan for reverse flow because I've never dealt with that before. So how it affects the protection on the system There's a learning curve that we're going through.

02:31:58.000 --> 02:32:04.000
And we'll see how that anticipate that and be prepared for it when it happens.

02:32:04.000 --> 02:32:24.000
I know. All electric. Yep, all the homes, all the businesses And… I know they were saying by 2050 we'd have I know she was saying all county facilities and then all the rest of the county by 2070 or something.

02:32:24.000 --> 02:32:34.000
But like I said, to meet that schedule to meet that schedule We'll need some money.

02:32:34.000 --> 02:32:54.000
My SCADA system I just went over. Yep. We're doing the, like I said, Switzer The components are amazingly cheap. Spicer has lifetime warranty on most of their components, which is Impressive. I'm working with Mike from IT and he's and and tony

02:32:54.000 --> 02:33:06.000
Who's our water skater person and they're going to We do have SCADA from the town site station to the PCS, and so they've assured me we can get a connection there The rest of the devices will be modem and or radio.

02:33:06.000 --> 02:33:11.000
And I may have to install one on the ski hill next to the AMI antenna.

02:33:11.000 --> 02:33:15.000
To get full coverage, but we should be able to see everything there.

02:33:15.000 --> 02:33:24.000
Along with the ami system the ArcGIS mapping system And then our milsoft model.

02:33:24.000 --> 02:33:37.000
And once it is all complete, we'll have a real-time model running model so we can see exactly what is flowing on the system in real time.

02:33:37.000 --> 02:33:48.000
I know you've probably seen us the AMI system that's a indication of what Lyman sees when he looks on a screen at an outage You can see exactly where the the customers are affected.

02:33:48.000 --> 02:34:05.000
This alone gives them a good, because then they know where the fusing is for those areas and or if it affects the entire feeder so we know how to mobilize and how many people we're going to need When a lineman sees this, he knows if he can handle it by himself or if he's going to need

02:34:05.000 --> 02:34:09.000
You know start calling people

02:34:09.000 --> 02:34:30.000
Capital project proposals these are Of course, these change depending on outages that occur. But right now, DP phase two is in process. We're getting close to completing that. I think we need three more transformers We're converting over to the new system right now.

02:34:30.000 --> 02:34:37.000
We're about two weeks ahead of the week ahead the curb and gutter contractor So we should not be affecting them.

02:34:37.000 --> 02:34:45.000
We're taking small outages to transfer those lines. The EA4 line design, like I said, it's still in process. We're looking for that.

02:34:45.000 --> 02:35:01.000
Ski hill phase one, we're prepared for that. We have all the equipment we need for the the bypass of the tank And then I'm meeting next week again with Ernesto and the contractors on the placement of equipment all the way up the hill.

02:35:01.000 --> 02:35:10.000
Oppenheimer, Trinity, Oppenheimer, the RFP, now that Lumen is not joining the project. I'll clarify with procurement.

02:35:10.000 --> 02:35:19.000
And we'll get that project on the street. And then Piedra Loop La Sena will follow Very shortly, they'll be on the street.

02:35:19.000 --> 02:35:33.000
Then I'll begin on the Los Pueblos design. I have the most of the design ready but cost estimates and quantities are Have to be determined.

02:35:33.000 --> 02:35:48.000
Another small project that's not on here, a customer project is Eastgate. One of the contractors is one of the Building owners is upgrading to three phase So we're working with him install some new line. I need to replace that entire

02:35:48.000 --> 02:36:00.000
Business area. With a new conductor because the growing demand So that's underway right now. There'll be a small traffic impediment there.

02:36:00.000 --> 02:36:05.000
And that's it. Any questions? Thank you, Steve.

02:36:05.000 --> 02:36:12.000
Questions? If you go back to your list of projects.

02:36:12.000 --> 02:36:28.000
Considering all the increases in prices and supply chain issues i mean how how well are you hitting your original plans, right? Like if you laid out your plan a year ago or two years ago or something like that, and you said, okay, here's where we are on knocking back these projects.

02:36:28.000 --> 02:36:34.000
Basically how delayed are you fundamentally um

02:36:34.000 --> 02:36:51.000
In the laser are coming in most of them I'm beginning the 2025 project now because as soon as the budget was approved last year, I ordered the materials so we're getting it in and constructing now. So we're getting by with the delays

02:36:51.000 --> 02:37:11.000
As long as, you know, we're getting the orders in. Money-wise, they're hitting in pretty good where we haven't gone over, but I anticipate they will be me going over and the um The Los Arboles subdivision before and their first design they were launching their project. It was approved.

02:37:11.000 --> 02:37:27.000
I ordered the transformers and then they canceled it. So I ended up having a bumper crop of single phase transformers which was very beneficial because it was very beneficial We've been doing that helped our single phase transformer replacements And I have a you know a

02:37:27.000 --> 02:37:34.000
Some stock there for just in case, just because of just because I'm pretty skittish about letting loose of anything.

02:37:34.000 --> 02:37:40.000
In this environment. It's better to have it and not need it.

02:37:40.000 --> 02:37:46.000
But I think the biggest thing we'll be seeing is the money on these will be going up.

02:37:46.000 --> 02:38:00.000
My ski hill estimate is still good. Dp Road, I believe, is good. The design design Oppenheimer have 1.2 million. It's going to be Close.

02:38:00.000 --> 02:38:08.000
The Oppenheimer Trinity project was split into two. Currently, they're in process of the Oppenheimer section.

02:38:08.000 --> 02:38:24.000
And then as soon as they get up to, we're having a lot of trouble with We got the traffic control plan working with the general county got traffic control plan issued it to DOT. They did half a dozen iterations. He finally said, okay, it's a good plan.

02:38:24.000 --> 02:38:30.000
But you need a traffic control supervisor. And our linemen are all traffic control supervisors.

02:38:30.000 --> 02:38:38.000
We showed him the certificate, but he said it's not good. They need to have the card And you send in for the card and i told him, well.

02:38:38.000 --> 02:38:47.000
It's just a procedure to get the card, but they all passed the class And no, so we're waiting for a card.

02:38:47.000 --> 02:38:59.000
So traffic control is a problem. If we can't get that resolved, I'm planning on joining that section in front of the gas station with the Trinity Project and the contractor will do the DOT work.

02:38:59.000 --> 02:39:05.000
We seem to always have trouble with DOT on traffic control.

02:39:05.000 --> 02:39:11.000
We'll give them a plan. They'll make one change, send it back. We'll make the change, send it back. They'll give us another change.

02:39:11.000 --> 02:39:18.000
And then we do iterations. I'm sure some of the other engineers here can attest to that.

02:39:18.000 --> 02:39:29.000
It's always a process. But the Trinity Project will be proceeding. I know that the customers may be upset because Lumen is going to be there.

02:39:29.000 --> 02:39:35.000
And then just about the time they finish, we're going to jump in and be blocking the same exact lanes.

02:39:35.000 --> 02:39:39.000
That they were. So I tried my best to avoid that.

02:39:39.000 --> 02:39:45.000
But they did once they got their DOT approval. They were jumping for joy.

02:39:45.000 --> 02:39:57.000
They're ready to go. They will be boring. They're not open trench so it may not be as disruptive When I go through there with a trench behind the curb.

02:39:57.000 --> 02:40:03.000
But…

02:40:03.000 --> 02:40:08.000
Sure. Just a quick question. I know you're tracking solar deployments, residential solar.

02:40:08.000 --> 02:40:19.000
Can you comment on residential battery deployments in the county? I have in the past several months, I think I have two more battery installations.

02:40:19.000 --> 02:40:36.000
So we're probably up to about eight or eight or eight or eight or ten I do have… several requests that have been coming through. They haven't installed but they're looking for the they're a meter socket type attachment that provides for a backup generator

02:40:36.000 --> 02:40:50.000
To power through the meter. And those are UL approved. And I've been doing some research and for the size of generator they're they're doing, that's what i have to make sure that it meets the requirements. They will need a state permit

02:40:50.000 --> 02:40:56.000
To do that also. But that's the new thing that's coming in.

02:40:56.000 --> 02:41:15.000
On that type of generation. There's no, I haven't gotten any any other large scale battery You know, I had a customer before wanted to to put in, I think, 40 KW of battery And I told him he could connect 10

02:41:15.000 --> 02:41:35.000
To his 10 KW system, but the other 30 would have to be island And so that's what he did. So he's prepared to to go off grid well The batteries that I am getting seen come in are still the power walls

02:41:35.000 --> 02:41:51.000
And with a gateway. And those are good systems but Still very slow. I have no I don't know that anyone would, but I haven't had any mention of uh vehicle to grid connections.

02:41:51.000 --> 02:42:04.000
I would require a home management system, a power management system also for them to do that but um I haven't seen any of those.

02:42:04.000 --> 02:42:14.000
Steve, on the last, you outlined that that would… increase our redundancy.

02:42:14.000 --> 02:42:19.000
Hence reliability by a fair amount. Does that also increase capacity?

02:42:19.000 --> 02:42:35.000
Of the distribution system? Yes, because it relieves load off the existing feeders That provides added capacity on the on the existing feeders which are now in service.

02:42:35.000 --> 02:42:54.000
Instead of a feeder seeing 150 amps per phase, that feeder will be seeing 75 you know just and split. So it does provide for increased capacity which will help with electrification on the main feeders within the neighborhoods it doesn't, you know, it does nothing

02:42:54.000 --> 02:42:59.000
Reliability within the neighborhoods but the main feeders will see a benefit.

02:42:59.000 --> 02:43:11.000
Well, that's part of it. Thank you. I'd like to get a little bit more information on this primary line cut down at the ice rink.

02:43:11.000 --> 02:43:30.000
Given the potential seriousness of something like that. How close did the contractor or whomever come to come to any more serious event

02:43:30.000 --> 02:43:37.000
What other than don't dig through live feeder lines.

02:43:37.000 --> 02:43:41.000
Which is obvious, what did we learn from it

02:43:41.000 --> 02:43:50.000
Well, the same lesson we have with all the projects like DP Road right now is that I tell my linemen now.

02:43:50.000 --> 02:43:56.000
To go confirm, you know, go buy these projects, look for the locates. We catch them.

02:43:56.000 --> 02:44:15.000
You know, quite often excavating without locates or they wipe them out you know construction project traffic You know, they blade an area, they do something and they don't um They don't make offset marks or stakes to their locates. So we talk to them and ask them to

02:44:15.000 --> 02:44:35.000
To stake it, to be aware of it. So it's just diligence on on part uh they have been calling for their locates And there have been occasions where the locates were not completed on time and the contractor will You know, the clock said go so they start going

02:44:35.000 --> 02:44:44.000
And so we just got to make sure that it's I know Erwin, the locator, I believe he got a position with GWS.

02:44:44.000 --> 02:44:47.000
If they're going to be going out for a new locator.

02:44:47.000 --> 02:44:53.000
I hope that they will hire someone who's able to attach to the actual electric lines.

02:44:53.000 --> 02:45:07.000
To make sure that, you know, locates are accurate. Because if you're going just by the 60 cycle wave, you know, you'll pick up communication lines and You could wander off a little bit on your locates.

02:45:07.000 --> 02:45:25.000
Like on DP Road. Right now they're digging in. I think they're doing drop inlets but we have a headlines that are brand new that are not energized. And then we have the existing lines So I have my linemen out there making sure they're locating both of them.

02:45:25.000 --> 02:45:32.000
Because even though that contractor installed those lines, they have a habit of digging into stuff they just put in.

02:45:32.000 --> 02:45:40.000
And if they damage some of those transformers, that would be unfortunate because there's several transformers that I do not have spares for.

02:45:40.000 --> 02:45:45.000
They're on order, but they're not here yet.

02:45:45.000 --> 02:46:02.000
So what is what can or is the department doing to reduce the risk of cutting lines which cut service or even worse.

02:46:02.000 --> 02:46:10.000
Cause… damage or casualties.

02:46:10.000 --> 02:46:19.000
What are we doing to reduce that? You've said, okay, it's you know we've got locate issues, but what are we doing about it?

02:46:19.000 --> 02:46:33.000
Well, like I said, we send our linemen out to to do checks on it. Stephen Abatea has been good about he brings us locates if he If it's a large project area or a large wide area locate.

02:46:33.000 --> 02:46:38.000
Or if some other situation his locator is unavailable or overworked.

02:46:38.000 --> 02:46:54.000
He brings us the locates and then I put alignment on them to make sure they get done and they get done correctly Other than that, there's not much else we can do to make sure that contractors are doing. There's more.

02:46:54.000 --> 02:47:03.000
Philo? Anyone that ask for a locate who within the last year gets a letter from us every year.

02:47:03.000 --> 02:47:15.000
We keep an active data list. And that's through Jennifer Baca and through engineering that we put out notification, the importance of 811.

02:47:15.000 --> 02:47:24.000
We put those in newsletters i think um you know contractors.

02:47:24.000 --> 02:47:51.000
There's… Here's… a lot of notification done through the mail and surveys and other contacts but You know, and Stephen's saying… There are situations where contractors wipe out their locates and that's the problem that Like he said, if they do frequent checks, that's how to prevent that.

02:47:51.000 --> 02:47:56.000
Where's your marks are missing. So this is a 15 kV line.

02:47:56.000 --> 02:48:02.000
That they dug through. Okay. What do they dig through with a front end loader or a bucket?

02:48:02.000 --> 02:48:08.000
Yeah, backhoe bucket. Okay. It's shielded cable. Obviously. And so we got protective relaying.

02:48:08.000 --> 02:48:18.000
And so when the metal goes, and I'm not trying to minimize this but I think there's very little possibility of any kind of injury.

02:48:18.000 --> 02:48:24.000
Because the bucket's going to go through the shield We're what kind of hole did it leave in the bucket?

02:48:24.000 --> 02:48:32.000
None. Okay, there you go. It didn't even arc. I mean, sometimes because I've cut through live lines with saws and everything, I never knew I cut through them.

02:48:32.000 --> 02:48:35.000
And then I look at the blade of my cell and I go.

02:48:35.000 --> 02:48:41.000
What's that burnt tooth doing on there? What is that? Well, it turned out I cut through the line.

02:48:41.000 --> 02:48:49.000
The tractor relaying takes it out, very little danger. It's a pain in the butt and it's it's, you know, to fix everything.

02:48:49.000 --> 02:48:58.000
But I think the personnel hazard is actually very minimal. Yeah, our cable has a concentric neutral that is outside of the insulation.

02:48:58.000 --> 02:49:15.000
So in the cases when they break the cable. Conductor goes to ground. It hits the shield because whatever it if you were going to cut through it, the saw would cut through the shield. It's in contact with the shield and then it hits the conductor. Protective relaying takes it out.

02:49:15.000 --> 02:49:24.000
And another thing with the locates is when they do hit a conductor There's third-party damage report issued.

02:49:24.000 --> 02:49:43.000
If it's determined that it's you know it's their fault then they will pay for the the damage and they get reported to the PRC and the company and the operator deal with the PRC on that if they have multiple violations i imagine

02:49:43.000 --> 02:49:52.000
It could get pretty bad for the operator. Did this one get reported? Yes, they all get reported. It's the law. Okay.

02:49:52.000 --> 02:50:07.000
Well, hopefully most Hopefully there aren't casualties with this but Something more than 20 years ago, there was a fatality at the laboratory laboratory.

02:50:07.000 --> 02:50:16.000
Subcontractor jackhammered through a live 13 kV line during the DP site demolition.

02:50:16.000 --> 02:50:34.000
The lano lines have a a different configuration they're Delta. A lot of their feeders have a Separate and neutral. They have run neutral run conductors three conductors and then a separate neutral So he may have just a conductor straight up.

02:50:34.000 --> 02:50:49.000
Well, and it was also red concrete that he was Jack Crapper into. So that was, you know, my gosh, really seriously it was red concrete, which means a line is electrical duct bank and and he still went through with it

02:50:49.000 --> 02:51:05.000
Which was… Well, it can kill people. If there isn't great care. Yes, it is a It is a dangerous business. Okay. Any other questions or comments?

02:51:05.000 --> 02:51:23.000
Okay. Thank you, Steve. Thank you. Appreciate it. So we have the biennial update on integrated resource plan implementation. Ben.

02:51:23.000 --> 02:51:40.000
Thank you, Chair Gibson, board members Haven't been to you in a while with this content. However, I have provided updates on foxtail flats and other resources along the way. So I expect unless you have some new questions for me, this should be a pretty

02:51:40.000 --> 02:51:45.000
Quick presentation. This thing going to work for me?

02:51:45.000 --> 02:51:53.000
Or did you do that? It worked? Okay, great. Just to give you some background on what we're covering here, this presentation covers our future resource.

02:51:53.000 --> 02:52:00.000
Status updates only. Not really talking about the current assets that we have and the current BPAs.

02:52:00.000 --> 02:52:03.000
Just about what we're doing in the future, what we're planning for in the future.

02:52:03.000 --> 02:52:10.000
To achieve our goals. The previous IRP implementation update was on October 2nd.

02:52:10.000 --> 02:52:25.000
24. Yes, I just noticed that. Covering uh Los Alamos purple goals, IRP load forecast and preferred portfolio, generation planning summary changes since the 2022 IRP.

02:52:25.000 --> 02:52:28.000
Load and generation planning and the need for an updated IRP.

02:52:28.000 --> 02:52:33.000
Those all had a bunch of slides associated with them. I have stripped those out, so we're not going to go over those here.

02:52:33.000 --> 02:52:39.000
Unless anyone has any specific questions that i can speak to that bit.

02:52:39.000 --> 02:52:49.000
Like I say, the October presentation, if you want to read that, go ahead and take a look at the material is still up to date for the most part.

02:52:49.000 --> 02:52:56.000
Foxtail Flats. That's the one that's probably on everyone's mind because that's the newest resource that we're contracted for.

02:52:56.000 --> 02:53:06.000
We have a six month estimated slip to phase one, which is the 50% capacity for both the solar the PV and the battery system.

02:53:06.000 --> 02:53:17.000
That moves it from March to September of 2026 with a movement on the 100% COD, commercial operation date.

02:53:17.000 --> 02:53:25.000
To early 2027, notionally February, that had been December of 26.

02:53:25.000 --> 02:53:34.000
We did get a formal notice of an excused delay, and that's contract language That is built into the PPA and the ESA.

02:53:34.000 --> 02:53:52.000
Which, and I quote here, there was a potential for the sellers not obtaining a final non-appealable Ute lease approval on or before December 31st, 2024. And that occurred, which entitled them to a excuse delay, which means they can push out the

02:53:52.000 --> 02:53:58.000
Delivery dates with no penalty. However, there is a maximum on that.

02:53:58.000 --> 02:54:07.000
Excuse delay duration, I believe, of 365 calendar days. So they're cutting into that window.

02:54:07.000 --> 02:54:20.000
No change to report on the BIA review approval process. They were… My understanding is that they couldn't even do anything until at least March 21st.

02:54:20.000 --> 02:54:27.000
As far as approvals went. And I haven't heard anything back i've asked And they've said they have no updates on that.

02:54:27.000 --> 02:54:38.000
Developer has no updates. So does that mean they've just never considered it yet i don't know what's happening internally. I don't have any insight into that. The developer hasn't been able to give any color on that.

02:54:38.000 --> 02:54:46.000
It's just they couldn't make any decisions at a minimum. They being the tribe or BIA? Bia.

02:54:46.000 --> 02:54:51.000
So the developer is continuing to push them to get that.

02:54:51.000 --> 02:54:56.000
Don't know how much influence they have over that process, however.

02:54:56.000 --> 02:55:01.000
Sorry, is that the only remaining thing or is that separate from the Ute Mountain Ute lease approval?

02:55:01.000 --> 02:55:08.000
That's tied in there they're they're in. They're the same thing basically as far as we're concerned.

02:55:08.000 --> 02:55:18.000
The youte mountain use tribe itself has approved the lease, but it needs to go through the BIA for it actually go into effect.

02:55:18.000 --> 02:55:22.000
And if I misspoke anywhere there, Thomas, go ahead and pipe up.

02:55:22.000 --> 02:55:30.000
Correct me. We are tracking new risks for tariffs and tax credits.

02:55:30.000 --> 02:55:35.000
We don't have any details on. You know, probability or severity report at this time.

02:55:35.000 --> 02:55:51.000
But we're aware that there is a potential for those. We've also identified a potential for additional on-site energy storage which we don't plan on which we don't plan on pursuing any further at this time until we get a final lease one and

02:55:51.000 --> 02:56:06.000
Figure out that wherever they can deal with the risks. The risks, development risks effectively and uh when we have a final post 2025 ECA in place.

02:56:06.000 --> 02:56:16.000
We are currently planning for market power purchases to substitute, get substitute power to account for the delays in the power deliveries from Foxtail Flats.

02:56:16.000 --> 02:56:25.000
Just a wild guess on your part. What do you think the chances are that Foxtail Flats will Fold.

02:56:25.000 --> 02:56:33.000
I think the developer is motivated to do everything within their power to make sure But just wild guess on your part.

02:56:33.000 --> 02:56:48.000
I can't even begin to speculate. Less than 10%, less than 50%. The risk of it not happening risk of it not happening. I'd say it's currently low given the lack of concrete information defining the probability of these risks that were

02:56:48.000 --> 02:56:55.000
We believe exist. So I'd say it's a low probability Currently, that could change.

02:56:55.000 --> 02:57:00.000
Okay, thanks.

02:57:00.000 --> 02:57:11.000
Uams Geothermal, still working on two projects through UAMS. Cohort 2 is getting some legs There's a draft agreement in work between UAMS and the developer.

02:57:11.000 --> 02:57:29.000
Rodathorne is… is a little more speculative still at this point. I won't say it's at risk, but we just don't have enough information and defined financing plans and that sort of thing to really evaluate it yet at this time. So they're still looking to

02:57:29.000 --> 02:57:38.000
Refine their financing models and develop a further understanding of what the feasibility for the project is, say, in the next six months.

02:57:38.000 --> 02:57:42.000
Just a quick question. I can't remember. These are both less than a megawatt.

02:57:42.000 --> 02:57:48.000
Rod of therm is less than a megawatt. Co42 is around four megawatts. Okay, thanks. Our subscription share.

02:57:48.000 --> 02:58:11.000
Titlements share. Samuel Defonso Pueblo Solar and Storage. We just had a meeting with some representatives from that organization this morning. They have secured federal grant funding And they are still working to work with us in in tandem.

02:58:11.000 --> 02:58:19.000
And other surrounding utilities and trying to identify what their plan forward is going to be here for both the design and the transmission side of things.

02:58:19.000 --> 02:58:34.000
They're very interested in working with us as a partner. And so we're trying to have a good conversation with them and seeing what opportunities and what the best opportunity is for us to proceed.

02:58:34.000 --> 02:58:42.000
Kit Carson Hydrogen Project. Don't have any updates on that. Energy dome. I've mentioned this.

02:58:42.000 --> 02:59:01.000
Ep power system supervisor is very excited about this opportunity however He and I are both cognizant that the technology while they are Trying to prove it out in their Wisconsin full-scale facility. We haven't seen anything yet about what the actual real world

02:59:01.000 --> 02:59:11.000
Results are. So we're keeping an eye on that and maybe we'll take a trip out there and talk to them and see see what happens in the next, say, year or so when they can prove it out.

02:59:11.000 --> 02:59:15.000
Kind of a round trip efficiency they'll actually get out of it.

02:59:15.000 --> 02:59:23.000
Ben, do you have a contact with Energy Dome? Yes, I do. Okay. Can you mail that to me? Because I've contacted them, but they haven't responded.

02:59:23.000 --> 02:59:33.000
I understand. Okay, thanks. Yeah, they were there. I don't know if it's because they're uh overwhelmed with interest or if they're just a new developer.

02:59:33.000 --> 02:59:48.000
But yeah we had they probably saw my name and said it's junk. I doubt that. But they are a little tricky to make contact with. So once we made contact with them we're uh We'll be happy to. Okay, thanks.

02:59:48.000 --> 02:59:55.000
So that's, like I said, quick presentation today. I'd like to stand for any questions.

02:59:55.000 --> 03:00:18.000
Other questions from Ward? Okay, I've got a couple. Someplace I think I saw… I mean, you mentioned obviously for Foxteel Flats, you're not looking at further storage or anything else until till the till the till the till the existing project gets nailed down a little more firmly.

03:00:18.000 --> 03:00:24.000
I thought I saw someplace a mention of possibility of adding some wind to that project.

03:00:24.000 --> 03:00:30.000
Chair, board members we have floated that idea with the developer.

03:00:30.000 --> 03:00:38.000
Just at a very high level conceptual. They did respond with some concepts.

03:00:38.000 --> 03:00:44.000
And we really haven't pursued it further since then. That was probably Late.

03:00:44.000 --> 03:01:01.000
Ish fall of last year. Again, that's really on hold until we get any further understanding of where they're at. Yeah, I figured it would be but didn't think that would be a great location for wind but It's apparently not bad. Okay.

03:01:01.000 --> 03:01:20.000
Moving to the Sinai. Solar and storage Because what scale are they currently looking at for a plan, recognizing there might be a lot of customers, it wouldn't necessarily all be coming here, but what scale are they looking at?

03:01:20.000 --> 03:01:34.000
Notionally, their concept is for a 50 megawatt PV facility. Of which say maybe 10 megawatts they would reserve for tribal purposes.

03:01:34.000 --> 03:01:40.000
And how about storage? I don't believe I've heard anything on that.

03:01:40.000 --> 03:01:53.000
Particularly size. We were talking to them about the need for storage to complement the PV because for us, particularly nighttime load is what we're really looking at fill in these days.

03:01:53.000 --> 03:02:07.000
And we also expressed them the interest in the longer duration storage technologies which We recognize many of them other than say pumped hydro are very nascent.

03:02:07.000 --> 03:02:18.000
In the commercial technology. Area so But we did bring that up with them and told them where we kind of envision the storage segment of the project going.

03:02:18.000 --> 03:02:26.000
What could potentially be of best value for the county. Okay. Our vision statement.

03:02:26.000 --> 03:02:33.000
Talks about seeking innovative and diversified energy solutions.

03:02:33.000 --> 03:02:42.000
If Foxtail Flats goes forward. Which, of course, we all hope it does.

03:02:42.000 --> 03:03:04.000
Then do we… really want to add more solar Even though it would be a different location, but that diversifies geographically, but it doesn't diversify in terms of technology or or daylight or anything of that variety would we still… be really excited about pursuing

03:03:04.000 --> 03:03:29.000
More solar if Foxtail Flats meets its potential. If the long duration storage piece of it works out, then it could provide benefit there for the nighttime beyond just the PV piece of itself we're not I don't want to overstate the value of the nighttime piece here, but that's really what we're looking for.

03:03:29.000 --> 03:03:36.000
The daytime piece is that daytime PV is really intended to charge the batteries so that we can get as much nighttime as possible.

03:03:36.000 --> 03:03:44.000
Within the financial constraints that we see. And nighttime is probably going to be about $140 a megawatt.

03:03:44.000 --> 03:03:49.000
Potentially. And that's about what we're seeing, for example.

03:03:49.000 --> 03:03:55.000
If we were to buy into a peak rent. So.

03:03:55.000 --> 03:04:03.000
Okay. Any other questions or comments from the board? All right. Thank you very much, Ben.

03:04:03.000 --> 03:04:14.000
You're welcome. Appreciate it. Okay, last item is an announcement of a BPU vacancy.

03:04:14.000 --> 03:04:26.000
As we all know. There's a term expires every year and a year It's Eric's term that expires this year. Not Eric, just Eric's term.

03:04:26.000 --> 03:04:32.000
The… Oh, no, we don't.

03:04:32.000 --> 03:04:41.000
Anyhow. There is a…

03:04:41.000 --> 03:04:47.000
I need you.

03:04:47.000 --> 03:04:57.000
Brochure. Actually an updated brochure that was handed out this evening that you may want to take a look at.

03:04:57.000 --> 03:05:09.000
Action required here. I do understand that There has been action at the county clerk's office and we have two board members who have changed their party affiliation.

03:05:09.000 --> 03:05:36.000
And that does mean that The bottom line is that the bottom line is under no scenario of no of new member appointment would we be exceeding the supermajority that the charter prohibits. So any registered voter in Los Alamos County is eligible to apply for the board.

03:05:36.000 --> 03:05:49.000
Are there any yeah you can see the schedule on here. We would hope to have Hope to have a new board member appointed by late May.

03:05:49.000 --> 03:06:02.000
Any questions? Maybe importantly for anybody who's listening, our huge audience out there. The deadline for applications is May the 1st.

03:06:02.000 --> 03:06:07.000
So you too could have all the fun and frolic of a Board of Public Utilities member.

03:06:07.000 --> 03:06:17.000
If you get your application in. I did reapply. I figured it's a good way to stay off the street and out of drugs.

03:06:17.000 --> 03:06:23.000
Okay, we'll just leave that one there.

03:06:23.000 --> 03:06:30.000
It's all the homework. Yeah.

03:06:30.000 --> 03:06:43.000
Okay, let's see. I believe that's all we have except for another opportunity for public comment on any utilities item this evening.

03:06:43.000 --> 03:06:54.000
Is there any in chambers? Is there any online? Chair Gibson, there are three people. So if anybody would like to make public comment, this is your last chance.

03:06:54.000 --> 03:06:59.000
Raise your hand. I don't see anyone. Okay. With that, we are adjourned.